Conquests Bug Thread - Page 13

notyoueither · December 15, 2003, 00:26

Quote:

Originally posted by Rommel2D
I'm not sure where this fits, but the C3C package says it includes PtW. So, why do I have to swap out CDROMs to play my PtW PBEM? Is there some additional install step that will recognize the Conquests disc when making the copywrite protection check for PtW?

Now that's a damn good question.

korn469 · December 15, 2003, 00:38

not sure if this is a bug or a design feature but...

when you mod a building to automatically create armies it ignores the army limit, and will build an unlimited amount of armies

Harovan · December 15, 2003, 04:44

More evidence of the infamous "submarine" bug. It seems to be a more general "stealth unit" bug. In the Middle Ages scenario I (Germany/HRE) twice saw a Byzantine settler/spearman party running into an Abbasid stealth unit (assassin or something alike), both times resulting in a declaration of war of Byzantium vs the Abbasids. I imagine, that this can get very annoying, especially if there are a lot of these units running around.

Salah al-Din · December 15, 2003, 04:50

I've never encountered this before in the original Civ 3, and I haven't seen it mentioned here yet but I just randomly came across a rather unusual feature/bug concerning the culture radius in C3C.

As you can see, my capital has a Culture Radius of 3, yet it appears the boundary can't cross over into Ocean squares

kring · December 15, 2003, 04:54

Quote:

Originally posted by Rommel2D
I'm not sure where this fits, but the C3C package says it includes PtW. So, why do I have to swap out CDROMs to play my PtW PBEM? Is there some additional install step that will recognize the Conquests disc when making the copywrite protection check for PtW?

Did you install C3C over PtW, or uninstall PtW, then install C3C?

I installed C3C on machines that already had PtW installed, and have noticed the same problem. I run some PtW games and noticed it recently. To compound matters, it was refusing to recognize my PtW CD when I was trying to start PtW. After numerous attempts, I was able to start PtW, but it was a big pain in the neck.

Quote:

Originally posted by Salah al-Din
I've never encountered this before in the original Civ 3, and I haven't seen it mentioned here yet but I just randomly came across a rather unusual feature/bug concerning the culture radius in C3C.

As you can see, my capital has a Culture Radius of 3, yet it appears the boundary can't cross over into Ocean squares

Cultural boundaries don't cover Ocean squares and haven't in the past. If you create a map in the editor and place Ocean next to a city, then it can, but that is the only time.

Dominae · December 15, 2003, 15:13

Quote:

I set up a test scenario for a multiplayer democracy game. In order to get things just right, since PBEM worker jobs are handled a bit differently than SP worker jobs, I fired up the scenario as a PBEM, setting up 2 human players. I figured that I could just "continue game" instead of "save and quit" in order to do my testing (and just skip turn for the 2nd civ).

Wrong. Trying to do that screws things up. To be more precise, worker job times are halved. I ordered a forest chop (4 turns). The next turn, it told me there were 2 turns left. Next turn, it was done and the worker could move. Doh!

Yes, I've noticed this too. However, Worker-turns behave normally in Hotseat. So there's no simple way of doing tests for PBEM games.

This just introduces a bug that I'm surprised no one has mentioned yet:

In PBEM games, Worker actions complete one full turn sooner than normal. This may not seem like a big deal because the Worker is "paralyzed" during that extra turn, so the next job is always started on schedule. However, it marks a distinct difference between SP and PBEM play, the most noticeable effects being the 10 Shields from Chop Forest actions, which come in one turn sooner, or Build Road, which provides the movement benefit after only 2 turns (1 turn for Industrious civs).

I really hope this is a bug and not a feature.

---

Another bug, this one specific to the Sengoku Conquest:

1. All the tribes have the same civilopedia description. I assume this is not a bug, since it would be very time-consuming to research the history of 10+ different clans. However:

2. Do the tribes in Sengoku have traits/strengths? I assume not, since: 1) there is no way of figuring out way they are in the Civilopedia, and 2) the "strengths" link in the Civilopedia is broken.

2. The Civilopedia entry for Golden Ages describes the standard two ways of triggering them: UUs and Wonders. But without traits/strengths, triggering a GA with Wonders is impossible in the Sengoku campaign.

Dominae

Arrian · December 15, 2003, 15:34

Quote:

In PBEM games, Worker actions complete one full turn sooner than normal. This may not seem like a big deal because the Worker is "paralyzed" during that extra turn, so the next job is always started on schedule. However, it marks a distinct difference between SP and PBEM play, the most noticeable effects being the 10 Shields from Chop Forest actions, which come in one turn sooner, or Build Road, which provides the movement benefit after only 2 turns (1 turn for Industrious civs).

I only recently found out about this. Somehow, I just never noticed it, until E_T told me about it. It is weird, and it does convey a benifit if you know about it. You can use a road 1 turn early, or a mine, or irrigation... whatever.

Though it's strange and perhaps should be fixed, frankly as long as I know how it works, I don't really care. The differences between PBEM & other formats of play is the one that's driving me NUTS. Testing is just brutal.

-Arrian

Dominae · December 15, 2003, 15:42

Worker actions is the main difference, if you ask me. What other differences are you referring to?

Arrian · December 15, 2003, 15:55

That's what I meant... but E_T also mentioned some corruption differences he's noticed between attemped SP testing and the real (PBEM) ISDG.

-Arrian

Dominae · December 15, 2003, 16:18

I'm just confused as to why you "don't really care", yet they "drive you crazy".

Dominae

Arrian · December 15, 2003, 16:45

I don't really care about the worker jobs completing early. I *DO* care about the ridiculous method I must use to test anything for a PBEM game.

Clear now?

-Arrian

TheArsenal · December 15, 2003, 17:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Jaybe
In the epic game, I have had many seemingly unintentional wars started by naval units running into my submarines.

This did not happen in PTW, and I wonder if it was intentional.

This is a helluva bug. I made the mistake of building a good number of subs and had two wars triggered within a handful of turns this way. The first war I did not mind so much because I was planning it anyway and just went to battle a few turns early and destroyed the AI civ completely. The second, however, completely screwed a diplomatic victory I positioned myself for by making a formerly polite and quite large neighbor go to war with me and drag another polite civ into it by alliance.

Dominae · December 15, 2003, 17:06

Quote:

Clear now?

Crystal.

I care about both. I want PBEM to be exactly like SP, except against human opponents.

Dominae

Arrian · December 15, 2003, 17:18

Yeah, well, the fact is that one thing (the difference in worker jobs between PBEM and SP) causes the other (the method required to test for PBEMs). So if they do what you want (make PBEM work like SP), we will both be happy.

-Arrian

notyoueither · December 15, 2003, 19:06

Quote:

Originally posted by Salah al-Din
I've never encountered this before in the original Civ 3, and I haven't seen it mentioned here yet but I just randomly came across a rather unusual feature/bug concerning the culture radius in C3C.

As you can see, my capital has a Culture Radius of 3, yet it appears the boundary can't cross over into Ocean squares

Not a bug. Borders never go into Ocean.

Gibsie · December 16, 2003, 09:16

What I really don't get is how the AI supposedly knows the exact location if every one of your units (Something in every game like this) yet it still accidentally trigges wars by running into invisdible units. D'oh!

Arrian · December 16, 2003, 10:00

I think that resulted from an earlier fix, actually, Gibsie. IIRC, the AI used to be able to "see" invisible units too, and people complained. Why can the AI see my subs!! Which made sense. It was weird getting the "leave our territory" message when the only unit you had in there was a submarine.

-Arrian

TheArsenal · December 17, 2003, 12:04

Well, if it comes down to an “either/or” situation, I would rather subs remain invisible to the AI and put up with the sudden wars, understanding that building and using subs is a risk. In the perfect world, however, war would only be declared if an AI ship ran into you in their territorial waters with the two nations having no ROP.

Tripledoc · December 17, 2003, 12:54

When you get two scientific leaders the same turn. Possible if you are the first to discover of Philosophy or, presumbly, if you Build the theory of Evolution and discover two techs as the first the science leaders have the same name. They should have different names.

Willem · December 17, 2003, 13:51

Quote:

Originally posted by Tripledoc
When you get two scientific leaders the same turn. Possible if you are the first to discover of Philosophy or, presumbly, if you Build the theory of Evolution and discover two techs as the first the science leaders have the same name. They should have different names.

In the readme notes of the upcoming patch, Firaxis mentioned that this will be fixed.

Rommel2D · December 17, 2003, 15:22

Quote:

Posted by Kring:
Did you install C3C over PtW, or uninstall PtW, then install C3C?

I installed C3C on machines that already had PtW installed, and have noticed the same problem. I run some PtW games and noticed it recently. To compound matters, it was refusing to recognize my PtW CD when I was trying to start PtW. After numerous attempts, I was able to start PtW, but it was a big pain in the neck.

I installed C3C over my current setup, as the manual instructs. After I posted here, I saw another thread where someone had the same problem, tried a re-install, and messed up their system. Swapping discs isn't a big deal, not worth messing with an uninstall just to see if it works. It would be nice not to have to swap, and I figure someone who has vanilla only and buys Conquests expecting to be able to start PtW as advertised is going to be pissed (assuming the previous installation isn't the probem).

[Speaking of bugs, is there a reason some of the threads I've contributed to send out email notification of new posts, while some don't?]

ajerzguy · December 17, 2003, 15:48

I'm an avid MP player and C3C does not save the scores of eliminated Civs as PTW did. When a Civ is eliminated in C3C that Civs score is deleted. It would also be nice that when a Civ is elimnated that the score at the time elimination be frozen. PTW would save it but as the game progressed it would decrease. I don't know if this has any affect on the SP gamers but it is a pain in the neck trying to gather scores in MP.

A prime example was a game that I was just in. I was eliminated and my final score was not recorded in the histograph. I had to reload the the save game to find out what my score was. Had I not had auto save on I would never had known what I had ended with.

Thanks to all concerned

vmxa1 · December 17, 2003, 19:30

I was not fond of that change either. Not sure why it was done.

sabrewolf · December 17, 2003, 20:06

just started a 200x200 24-civ deity game and saw a stack of 4 babylonian spearmen and 2 warriors marching southwest. the units must have started their voyage around the first turns. extending their marching vector (assuming they're going to attack someone) they'd need around 60 turns to get to the next civ (they walked straight past me).

now my question is: where the hell are they going to?
and my second question: why?

to me this may be a bug (however, i never play huge maps otherwise, so maybe it's normal). these units should either explore, defend or pop huts. but definetly not in a 6 unit stack...

Willem · December 18, 2003, 14:52

Quote:

Originally posted by sabrewolf

now my question is: where the hell are they going to?
and my second question: why?

Chances are they're heading for a Barbarian hut. The AI will send out ridiculous numbers of troops to clear out a camp, and they'll usually disregard your borders in order to do so.

pauli · December 19, 2003, 11:42

yeah. on the plus side, you can use that habit to capture massive portions of the ai military... preferably on ground with no defensive bonuses. then get someone else to go to war with them

vmxa1 · December 19, 2003, 12:59

sabrewolf I have not played a lot of huge maps, but it is very esay to have your scouting units out so far that it is 30-40 turns to return. In fact I find they often cannot return as the land has been covered and the AI will get upset when then enter its land. Sometimes, I am at war already and the poor warriors are faced with swords or better.

sabrewolf · December 19, 2003, 20:22

yep, i know that. in my sengoku-game my first warrior (well the one with the 1,1,1 stats) reached the end of the island at the end of the first age.

what i meant was the AI sending 6 (nearly all) of his starting units in a stack to a point far, far away. wierd to me...

vmxa1 · December 20, 2003, 00:51

That is probably a scenario glitch.

pauli · December 20, 2003, 09:52

could be the old international dateline bug from civ2