The Planetary Datalinks

d=me · November 21, 2003, 12:56

Does anybody feel that the planetary datalinks is too powerful?

Hippi · November 21, 2003, 13:04

I feel it's the most useless SP there is. I'm always ahead of the AI in tech and it's not that great even in MP. It's among the SPs I almost never bother to build (unless playing for score)

Alinestra Covelia · November 21, 2003, 13:11

I frequently play as a tech starved faction (Hive) and as such it's usually pretty nice to have.

Darsnan · November 21, 2003, 13:31

I sometimes use the PDL to create an ersatz "Tech Engine" Faction when building Challenges or PBEM games. Not the best approach, but depending upon what Factions the human players have chosen (or the circustances incorporated into a Challenge) why this can sometimes work out quite well as it will almost ensure that the AI possessing the PDL (and any associated Pactmates) won't fall completely behind tech-wise once the humans pact for increased energy/ research points.

D

CEO Aaron · November 21, 2003, 13:37

The Planetary Datalinks is definitely a huge klunker. The only reason to build it is to keep a rival faction from having it. Most games where I've built it, it has never gotten me a single tech, mainly because by the time I've reached the tech level I need to build it, I've already probed my rivals for any techs I haven't discovered already.

d=me · November 21, 2003, 13:56

Quote:

Originally posted by Hippi

I feel it's the most useless SP there is. I'm always ahead of the AI in tech and it's not that great even in MP. It's among the SPs I almost never bother to build (unless playing for score)

But the peacekeeprers usually seems to get it and since the're usually not the most technologically advanced faction, it can get them a lot of free techs and actually become the most technologically advanced faction by stealing off other factions.

CEO Aaron · November 21, 2003, 15:23

Well, when I'm playing PK's they're _definitely_ the most advanced faction. CF my earlier note about building it to keep the AI from getting it.

Alex · November 21, 2003, 15:38

I also build it mainly to keep another faction from getting it.

timotheus4 · November 21, 2003, 22:56

When playing as anybody it is a must have. Otherwise you're researching for someone else or having someone else research for you. As the believers, I always build it as soon as I can.

d=me · November 22, 2003, 00:24

Quote:

Originally posted by timotheus4
When playing as anybody it is a must have. Otherwise you're researching for someone else or having someone else research for you. As the believers, I always build it as soon as I can.

Exactly, that's why I said it adds too much advantage. should it be disabled with the scenario editor?

Darsnan · November 22, 2003, 00:57

A good CMN will take this SP's advantages into account when designing a game, and either pre-assign it to an AI Faction for appropriate reasons, or make it into a situation whereby it necessarily becomes a race to reach this SP's prerequisite tech. I prefer the previous strategy, if only because its easier for a CMN to arrange....
The same can be done by a CMN with Roze whereby she is given infiltration on all other Factions by the CMN, and she then essentially has the same capabilities as the PDL at gamestart.

btw I am thinking that the next time I post to a "We Need a SMAC2!" thread, that another thought I have is that a CMN should have the ability to give a Faction (whether human or AI) an SP's Abilities, without necessarily dedicating the specified SP to that specific Faction. From a CMN's perspective (i.e. an enhanced PBEM and Scenario generation capability ) why this would give an added dynamic flexibility to the game, as well as giving Players an incentive to research the necessary technologies and build the SP's that would previously have been unavailable to them due to the SP's already being pre-assigned.

D

ErikM · November 22, 2003, 00:59

Quote:

Originally posted by d=me
Exactly, that's why I said it adds too much advantage. should it be disabled with the scenario editor?

It's absolutely the worst of early-mid game projects.

Even the likes of Miriam would be better off building a bunch of quality probe teams instead of Datalinks.

Rather than disabling it, it may be worthwhile to reduce its cost to 200 mins and moving it somewhere earlier in the tech tree - say, to Planetary Networks or to Secrets of the Human Brain or thereabouts. Then building it just might be worthwhile (doubt it though

).

Mead · November 22, 2003, 01:04

Quote:

Originally posted by CEO Aaron
The Planetary Datalinks is definitely a huge klunker. The only reason to build it is to keep a rival faction from having it. Most games where I've built it, it has never gotten me a single tech, mainly because by the time I've reached the tech level I need to build it, I've already probed my rivals for any techs I haven't discovered already.

Unless I am playing as a badly tech deprived faction PDL is useless to me. Even as a bad researcher I will develop and maintain an ample probe force.

Usually, I get so far ahead of the pack it does not give me any techs.

I actually like someone else having it. It makes my tech costs cheaper. I guess I could sell the techs more often for extra cash as well.

Generally, I will not trade my killer techs (such as airpower/fusion/orbital) with anyone, so I am able to enjoy the exclusive use of the killer techs until someone else gets them on their own. So long as I keep good probe defense security and do not trade the killer techs I will be the sole owner and will have the exclusive use of these techs for a relatively long time.

Mead

Ogie Oglethorpe · November 22, 2003, 07:50

I'm not as critical of its performance as other are. Ususally PDL garners me about 3-4 techs in a given game which is better than say Universal Translator but all in all not an SP I'm gonna go gaga over.

Tau Ceti · November 22, 2003, 17:38

The PDL shows its true powers in MP games with 6 or 7 players, especially in team games.

In 2v2v2, it means your team always has any tech the two other teams have. In 3v3, it means the other team cannot exchange techs freely if they are to avoid having you get them for free. Both of these effects are huge.

timotheus4 · November 22, 2003, 20:43

Quote:

Originally posted by Mead

Unless I am playing as a badly tech deprived faction PDL is useless to me. Even as a bad researcher I will develop and maintain an ample probe force.

Usually, I get so far ahead of the pack it does not give me any techs.

I actually like someone else having it. It makes my tech costs cheaper. I guess I could sell the techs more often for extra cash as well.

Generally, I will not trade my killer techs (such as airpower/fusion/orbital) with anyone, so I am able to enjoy the exclusive use of the killer techs until someone else gets them on their own. So long as I keep good probe defense security and do not trade the killer techs I will be the sole owner and will have the exclusive use of these techs for a relatively long time.

Mead

But, you are effectively researching for yourself and the other people. I get PDL as more of a safety measure. Basically, when you get PDL, you are guaranteed technological parity with at least three factions.

gwillybj · November 23, 2003, 02:25

The way I play my SP games, if I need The Planetary Datalinks, I'm too far behind in tech to get to it before another faction builds it. If I am able to build it, I don't need it - and likely won't need it - but sometimes I build it anyway so no one else can

Datajack Franit · November 24, 2003, 19:40

It's not useless at all when the Believers get it

Enigma_Nova · November 26, 2003, 00:31

How does the PDL techstealing work?

I guess that once you have an infiltrator you can leech Tech, but observing that the PDL only steals from 3 factions, how does the game determine which faction to steal from?

Nakar Gabab · November 26, 2003, 05:33

The PDL is identical to the Great Library of Civ3. Yet the Library is considered invaluable and the PDL is considered useless. The reason is timing. Simply put, you will NEVER reach Cyberethics early enough that you'd not have all the techs you need to grab a commanding lead in the game, or at least in the tech race. I guess you could beeline to CybEth at the start... but why?

Nubclear · November 26, 2003, 05:44

Can't one simply change the PDLs prereq?

Hercules · November 26, 2003, 08:09

As Tau Ceti

Quote:

The PDL shows its true powers in MP games with 6 or 7 players, especially in team games.

Even in 4 or 5 player games: if players gang up against the leading faction and the leading faction has the PDL, care needs to be taken not to gift the leader with the latest and maybe critical tech that the other factions thru accelerated tech trading have acquired.

So not the most important SP especially in Sp games. And in MP games it can be useful to scoop up those techs on the tech tree that tend to be left to near the end.

timotheus4 · November 26, 2003, 22:16

Quote:

Originally posted by Nakar Gabab
The PDL is identical to the Great Library of Civ3. Yet the Library is considered invaluable and the PDL is considered useless. The reason is timing. Simply put, you will NEVER reach Cyberethics early enough that you'd not have all the techs you need to grab a commanding lead in the game, or at least in the tech race. I guess you could beeline to CybEth at the start... but why?

For the tech windfall. I usually do if playing as hive/beavers

Ogie Oglethorpe · November 26, 2003, 23:44

Quote:

Originally posted by Nakar Gabab
The PDL is identical to the Great Library of Civ3. Yet the Library is considered invaluable and the PDL is considered useless. The reason is timing. Simply put, you will NEVER reach Cyberethics early enough that you'd not have all the techs you need to grab a commanding lead in the game, or at least in the tech race. I guess you could beeline to CybEth at the start... but why?

Not quite. Great Library IIRC allows techs to be garnered if any two other civs have the tech its effects expire with electricity (I think). PDL requires 3 other factions to have the tech and its effect never expire. The requirement to have 3 other factions gain the tech is teh big difference. 2 factions/civs having the tech is a relatively easy feat whilst 3 factions/civs normally assures that any techs garned are lower tier (speed bump) ones that you normally bypass in your tech beelines.