Apolyton University Mod: C3C version - Page 6

lockstep · October 5, 2004, 13:22

A thanks from me also!

darok · November 17, 2004, 22:48

Thanks for all the work into improving the game. I just want to ask if the 1.07 version of the AU C3C mod with the cavalry changes is available for download yet? The link is only for 1.06.

alexman · November 18, 2004, 10:44

We are waiting for the vote on the Republic/Democracy change (which will happen in 5 days) before releasing 1.07.

nbarclay · November 19, 2004, 10:43

Darok, I posted a version of the AU Mod with the cavalry changes in the cavalry thread a while back. It's not an offiicial version of the Mod, but if you want to go ahead and start a game with the new cavalry version, it's available.

alexman · November 29, 2004, 12:25

Version 1.07 is posted, in anticipation of the next AU course.

Risa · January 11, 2005, 10:31

I spot a bug. (Or an undocumented feature?)
The scout unit is no longer able to upgrade to explorer. It was first discovered in AU505 game, and also exists in v1.07's .biq file.

alexman · January 11, 2005, 11:24

Thanks, nice catch.

Pfeffersack · January 30, 2005, 16:49

Two ideas, which could perhaps fit in the AU mod:

1) We all know how bad the AI is at making naval invasions.The main problem is it rarely uses more than one transport ship for invasions, which results in very few landed units.Since Conquests this is even worse, because capacity of modern transport has dropped from 8 to 6.A partial solution for this increasing capacity of all transports by a fix factor (say +100% - 400%, depending on the kind of map or scenario.For mods close to stock rules, a more conservative value is usually better).This leads to bigger AI invasions, especially on higher difficulty where the AI has enough units.

2. I tried recently to win agame via score and searched for ways to max it out.I read an article about "milking" strategies, including a note about the unusefulness of Future Tech (because its contribution to score is very low).Wouldn't it be good to provide the player with an alternative to milking and turning research to 0 after researching the last useful tech? There is no way to improve the score value of future tech, but we could drop its research cost - then every future tech would only take 1 or at least very few turns to research and you could get more points out of it.

punkbass2000 · January 30, 2005, 17:01

Minimum research time is four turns. If you could get four-turn research at ~10% funding, though, that might be worthwhile. I'm not a milker, so I don't really know. For the first proposal, I worry whether or not that would be to the player's advantage just as much, if not more, than the AI's. The AI rarely invades intercontinentally before Caravels, IME, so I would definitely leave Galleys and Curraghs the same.

Pfeffersack · January 31, 2005, 05:18

Ok, I had forgotten for the moment there is a minimum research time (had dropped that in RaR since a long a time ago;-) in stock rules, but 4 turns at 10% looks good.Guess I will mod cheaper Future Tech in my next AU game, to see how cheap it has to be (will start with 200; if this is to cheap I will try 300 next time)

About bigger capacity transports, you are possibly right about galleys.My tests for RaR on this subject have shown that, as you said, the AI tends to use it more the occassional from the MidA on.So in the ancient age it might work heavy in the human players favor, but after that IMHO things changes.The only advantage for the human player is needing less ships if invading, which isn't a so big deal, while the AIs are getting a serious advantage if it comes to war.Not so much directly against the human player, which is able to cope with that danger easily by intercepting transports etc. (another change which is helpful in this context is cheking the "needs naval escort" flag for galleons etc., if the AI tends to neclect escorts for transport ships - we have that problem in RaR) or at least beating of an even larger invasion force...its versus other AI players which aren't located on the same land mass.They are able to bring enough troops to conquer smaller to midsized islands and even erase smaller and backward civs completly.So the change leads to stronger AI superpowers.

I have added a minimap from a RaR Emperor game.Might be difficult to compare stock rules or the AU mod with RaR in this subject (sucessful conquering is supported in RaR by weaker stats of defending units and some more changes), but you can see the effect of bigger transports clearly.

Map Legend (arrows mark invasions): Grey India has took out the French and Persia in the West, parts of Korea (western part of the brown color Japanese island)and some minor islands.The green Atztecs attemped to
conquer purple Ethiopia with the help of Spain(red) and landed more than a dozen armors, only my intervention stopped them after taking some cities and the Ethiopians found time to recover.

Harovan · February 10, 2005, 05:14

How can I build the SPHQ? The civilopedia says, it has been moved to Communism, I am communistic and have Espionage, however it does not appear as option.

Overall I am pleased with the AU mod. It plays out smoothly and tries to lighten all the bugs left forever in C3C. I'm having a nice thematic game, the first full Civ3 game since a year. Not with the original AU mod, but with the AU "fun" mod, which is the AU C3C mod 1.07 with all resources back to PTW frequency and Demigod replaced by Mystic Hero. All else left as it is.

I am playing Russia/USSR on a large map with 12 civs, and my goal was to avoid my usual choice of governments (Republic/Democracy) in favor of something new for me (not for you, I know, I know): Monarchy and Communism.

There are a few things I want to mention nevertheless: First, I miss the usual diversity of governments. Every single AI civ goes the way Republic/Democracy, except the backwards ones, who are stuck at their own island and are Monarchies. This may be intended, but it looks somehow boring. I don't know if this is only in my game or a general symptome. Second, wow, Cossacks are powerful now with blitz, as opposed to Light Cavalries, who are pretty weak. Not too powerful by chance? Third, I applaud the work you did with armies. First I was upset, that I can load only a single unit in it, but after a while I got used to it and like the effect, that it blocks the AI from making his beloved Knight/Infantry/Swordsman army (you get the picture). But I think, T will miss his mixed armies.

I'm back to my game. It's fun. I am in the early modern age, this is usually the point, where I bail out through UN. Not in this game, though. Space race is disabled, and I want to play it to the end of the tech tree.

Da sdrawstwujet Kommunisticheskaya Partiya welikogo Lenina! Wperyod k kommunismu!

Modo44 · February 10, 2005, 05:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
How can I build the SPHQ? The civilopedia says, it has been moved to Communism, I am communistic and have Espionage, however it does not appear as option.

In the AU Mod, SPHQ is only available in Fascism. It's a bug in the Civilopedia for the SPHQ. It should read: "moved from Communism to Fascism". It shows correctly in the "ALLOWS" field in the Civilopedia for Fascism.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
There are a few things I want to mention nevertheless: First, I miss the usual diversity of governments. Every single AI civ goes the way Republic/Democracy, except the backwards ones, who are stuck at their own island and are Monarchies.

You might see some in Feudalism later. I don't know why, but sometimes the AI just likes it, the small ones more often than the big guys. You will see Communism too, as soon as they get it, and get into a long war.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
This may be intended, but it looks somehow boring. I don't know if this is only in my game or a general symptome.

It is normal, and good for the AI. Republic is the best overall government, and Democracy is very good, when you have a quick transition (like the AI has on higher difficulty levels). How is this different from stock, by the way? It seems the AI will almost always go Despotism -> Republic -> Democracy, if at peace - just as often with stock rules, as with the AU Mod.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Second, wow, Cossacks are powerful now with blitz, as opposed to Light Cavalries, who are pretty weak. Not too powerful by chance?

Why? Is it bad for an UU to be powerful? There are even stronger ones, and very weak ones as well. The strongest argument, lately, was to preserve the game feeling of stock rules. This means leaving strong UUs strong, and weak UUs weak. I mean, think of the F-15.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Da sdrawstwujet Kommunisticheskaya Partiya welikogo Lenina! Wperyod k kommunismu!

Oww, that hurt.

I mean, rule the world, comrade!

Harovan · February 10, 2005, 06:53

Thanks for explanations. Much appreciated.

Quote:

Originally posted by Modo44
Oww, that hurt.

I mean, rule the world, comrade!

Already working on bringing the lights of communism to all oppressed people of the world.

Wechnaya slava geroicheskoj Krasnoj Armii!

janilxx · February 16, 2005, 08:19

This mod seems to add some new luxury (etc) items when some of the techs are wounded. But why is there, in the tech screen, only a banana picture and it says something like Ignore [nbr]?

If this shouldn't happen and you have no idea about this, I can check this better at home and explain it also better here.

Krill · February 16, 2005, 09:48

IIRC, those hidden resources were added to make the AI value the techs more highly. They have a 0% chance of appearing on the map, so they don't alter the gameplay in any other way.

ZargonX · February 16, 2005, 10:25

Yes, that is correct, from what I recall. It's merely a "dummy" resource to gently nudge the AI into doing what it should be doing

ZargonX · February 16, 2005, 10:25

Yes, that is correct, from what I recall. It's merely a "dummy" resource to gently nudge the AI into doing what it should be doing

joncnunn · March 7, 2005, 15:59

Yes, but there are so many "dummy" resources / luxaries, along with some extra "add ability definately already have", that it seems to me to be more inflationary than directing reserach.

(That is increasing the trade value of all techs by the same amount instead of noticeably changing AI reserach path)

alexman · March 7, 2005, 16:23

Actually, there is a reason for every single dummy luxury in the mod. The current settings were derived after an insane amount of AI testing.

Please read the relevant thread and post your comments/complaints there.

TechWins · March 23, 2005, 21:23

Having a job where you basically do next to nothing except empty paper out of recycling bins every once in a while due to wanting to stand up and walk around for a while, leads you to have a lot of time on your hands. So I went through and read quite a few of the discussion topics of the AU Mod through and through. One of those topics was the flavor/preference thread on technologies for the AI, and based on the way that thread ended I can't seem to find any general consensus on what the ultimate decision was on using them. There aren't any mentionings of them in the readme, but I don't know if that's intentional or not to not allow people to understand the AI technology patterns easily. At any rate, could someone give me some clarification on the topic?

What I need to get is a flash drive (cheaper for me than buying a labtop) big enough that can hold an installation of Civ3 on it to play it at work... I wonder if Civ3 exceeds the 1gb mark after installation hmm... Okay, that's enough rambling. Thanks in advance for any response I may receive.

TechWins · March 26, 2005, 18:33

I'm in my game right now using the AU Mod v1.07, and I'm experiencing a very strange bug in all of my cities. The Cathedral is almost taking the cost of the Colosseum and the Colosseum is taking the cost of the Cathedral, but I don't know if that's precisely what is happening. I checked the biq file of the mod, and the Cathedral shows cost of 16 and the Colosseum shows cost of 11. The civilopedia represents them numbers accurately, as well. Has any been else noticed this bug, because up till now before using this mod I've never seen this happen. Below is a pic to help describe:

Theseus · March 26, 2005, 18:49

What civ are you playing?

Kloreep · March 26, 2005, 18:53

Yeah, that looks to me like you're simply seeing the advantages of the Celts.

Modo44 · March 26, 2005, 18:58

Quote:

Originally posted by TechWins
I'm in my game right now using the AU Mod v1.07, and I'm experiencing a very strange bug in all of my cities. The Cathedral is almost taking the cost of the Colosseum and the Colosseum is taking the cost of the Cathedral, but I don't know if that's precisely what is happening. I checked the biq file of the mod, and the Cathedral shows cost of 16 and the Colosseum shows cost of 11. The civilopedia represents them numbers accurately, as well. Has any been else noticed this bug, because up till now before using this mod I've never seen this happen. Below is a pic to help describe:

I think this is not a bug. I think you are simply playing a Religious civ, in which case a Cathedral has a cost of 80 Shields (half price), while a Colosseum still takets 110 to finish.

TechWins · March 26, 2005, 22:55

Ahhhhh wow I guess that's what only playing Civ3 once in the past year can do to you.