December 10, 2003, 11:57
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#61
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Emperor
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Get over yourselves,
You don't want to go to war that is your right. However, don't delude yourselves that your companies would get involved in Iraq for the good of Iraqis. European buisness operates on the same motives as all other buisnesses, their own profit.
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don't delude yourself that american companies are going over for the good of the iraqis.
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your total refusal to go to war to liberate the Iraqis
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the initial charge to war had nothing to do with 'liberation'.
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December 10, 2003, 11:57
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#62
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Deity
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Much ado about nothing. The spoils of war usually go to those who contribute.
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Blackwidow24 and FemmeAdonis fan club
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December 10, 2003, 11:58
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#63
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exactly.
canada did contribute though, especially with aid. granted, they didn't really support military action, but surely that aid should count for something ?
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December 10, 2003, 11:59
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#64
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Settler
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Quote:
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Originally posted by DinoDoc
Much ado about nothing. The spoils of war usually go to those who contribute.
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Only in barbaric times.
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December 10, 2003, 12:04
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#65
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Deity
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Q Cubed
exactly.
canada did contribute though, especially with aid. granted, they didn't really support military action, but surely that aid should count for something ?
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I dunno why they aren't the list. Maybe it has to do with not liking Quebec?
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December 10, 2003, 12:10
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#66
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King
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That's OK: we don't like Bush either.
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What?
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December 10, 2003, 12:14
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#67
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Warlord
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I'd be surprised if they would have wanted any reconstruction contracts. You're either out or in - and those places were definitely out.
There's also the sticky point of foriegn workers needing protection - none of those countries would depend on the coalition troops to protect them.
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December 10, 2003, 12:22
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#68
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King
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There is no hurry in negociating construction contracts, the US Army is still demolishing buildings and houses not flatened in the first pass.
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Statistical anomaly.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
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December 10, 2003, 12:24
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#69
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Originally posted by Winston
It's quite laughable that the opposition against taking out Saddam now all of a sudden want to cash in on the contracts.
Well now it's too late to join the Coalition of the Billing.
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It's quite laughable that the United States invaded Iraq in the first place to do the same thing -- cash in on contracts.
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STFU and then GTFO!
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December 10, 2003, 12:43
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#70
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Deity
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As an American taxpayer, I have no problem with excluding companies from non-participating countries from being prime contractors on our portion of the aid. It's our $19 billion, after all.
The Canadians can direct their own aid dollars as they wish. If they want to exclude American companies, they are free to do so.
As for France, Germany, or Russia, why any crocodile tears would be shed for them for missing out on contracts for American aid dollars is beyond me.
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I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
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December 10, 2003, 12:56
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#71
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King
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How much of that 20 Bil$ is going to Afghanistan?
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What?
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December 10, 2003, 13:11
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#72
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Settler
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Quote:
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Originally posted by DanS
As for France, Germany, or Russia, why any crocodile tears would be shed for them for missing out on contracts for American aid dollars is beyond me.
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And even still they can contest it on the basis of false justification namely "national security". They can simply claim that:
1) The allocation of said funds to such and such countries' companies but not to others is descriminatory.
2) The reason given is false.
And go to retaliational penalties. But I doubt they'd bother. Irony has some limits.
Last edited by Bereta_Eder; December 10, 2003 at 13:16.
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December 10, 2003, 13:25
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#73
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Emperor
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i still don't understand why wolf said it was about security reasons.
i still see it as retaliatory, justified, but petty.
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December 10, 2003, 13:30
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#74
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Settler
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I assume it's for internal consumption.
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December 10, 2003, 13:46
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#75
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Deity
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Quote:
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How much of that 20 Bil$ is going to Afghanistan?
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$1 billion, IIRC.
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I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
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December 10, 2003, 13:50
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#76
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Deity
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Quote:
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i still don't understand why wolf said it was about security reasons.
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It's pretty simple, really. They went against us on what we stated was a big security issue. It's not in our security interest to encourage that kind of behavior.
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I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
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December 10, 2003, 13:52
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#77
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Settler
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That's hardly a discouragement either.
As I said internal consumption.
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December 10, 2003, 13:54
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#78
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by paiktis22
2) The reason given is false.
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Remember, M. Wolfowitz does not give reasons false, true, in-between or whatever, he gives bureaucratic reasons, easily acceptable by all parties (no need to be relevant or clearly connected).
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Statistical anomaly.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
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December 10, 2003, 13:55
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#79
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Settler
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Wolfowitz is very warhawkish. Hilariously enough he is as much inept in foreign relations. Maybe that's not an accident.
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December 10, 2003, 14:00
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#80
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Emperor
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Quote:
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It's pretty simple, really. They went against us on what we stated was a big security issue. It's not in our security interest to encourage that kind of behavior.
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whether it was a security issue or not was the crux of the debate, wasn't it?
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December 10, 2003, 14:06
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#81
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Deity
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Quote:
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whether it was a security issue or not was the crux of the debate, wasn't it?
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Well, we have consistently stated that Iraq was an important security issue. So it is.
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I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
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December 10, 2003, 14:12
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#82
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Emperor
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america doesn't exactly have fiat, you know? perhaps it was to us. i'm still not completely convinced of that.
obviously, europeans saw things a bit differently.
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December 10, 2003, 14:26
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#83
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I don't think Europeans can decide whether or not a situation is an important security issue to the US. That's probably best left to the US.
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December 10, 2003, 14:27
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#84
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Settler
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I don't see why especially if it affects anyone else besides the US.
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December 10, 2003, 14:28
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#85
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Emperor
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the us should decide what's in its own best interest.
other countries should decide what's best in theirs.
perhaps to them, an attack on iraq was not the wisest nor best cours of action.
is that so hard to see?
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December 10, 2003, 14:29
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#86
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Deity
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Quote:
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america doesn't exactly have fiat, you know? perhaps it was to us. i'm still not completely convinced of that.
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Even if it wasn't, we said it was. So it was.
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I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
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December 10, 2003, 14:30
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#87
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Settler
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yet another logical breakdown.
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December 10, 2003, 14:31
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#88
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Emperor
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Wolfowitz' remarks on national security obviously refered back to the US' assertion of Iraq as an important security issue, that's why Europe can't really argue in the context of reconstruction deals that it wasn't.
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December 10, 2003, 14:32
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#89
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Settler
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Again it would have been fine if it had stayed at that declaration. From the moment it wasn't, it can.
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December 10, 2003, 14:46
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#90
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Emperor
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I wonder if the excluded countries can sue under the WTO and/or NAFTA (in the case of Canada)?
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