The Hare Krishna Saint Tortured And Poisoned To Death By His Judas Disciples

[Moti]

Hello, my name is Moti, it's great to visit your forum.

I always wondered what happen to the Hare Krishna's. It was such a nice movement in the late 60's and 70's based on pure religious principles and deep philosophy but became corrupt after the leader (Prabhupada) passed away. I recently found an article on the net which claims Prabhupada was tortured and poisoned by some of his so called followers. So it seems that the child abuse and other scandals were not connected to Prabhupada and the genuine movement but to these criminals. I have added a bit of the article below, if you want to read all of it go to the links, there are also some nice words from George Harrison about his feelings for Prabhupada and the teachings of the movement.

I'm interested to hear your views.

THE HARE KRISHNA SAINT TORTURED AND POISONED TO DEATH BY HIS JUDAS DISCIPLES
(Leaders of a Sinister Movement)

"SOMEONE HAS POISONED ME" - Srila Prabhupada, 1977.

His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, the world-famous saint, cultural ambassador, scholar, social reformer and founder of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, (I.S.K.CON), warned in a letter dated September 1970 that “the great sinister movement is within our Society.” In 1977 he was held in a small room and slowly tortured and poisoned “to death” by the leaders of this sinister movement, as the tape transcriptions in this document conclusively prove.

Srila Prabhupada continued translating his transcendental books up to the point of his death. Although he was personally being disturbed by these demons, still, he was merciful to the general people, who are suffering for want of Krishna consciousness. Even up to the point of death, Srila Prabhupada was trying to preach Krishna consciousness. In fact his only concern was that all the people of this planet should receive the highest perfection of life namely Love of Krishna (God). So Srila Prabhupada truly manifested the symptoms of a Saint on the topmost level of self realization. On one side he was tolerant of his own sufferings and on the other side he was merciful.

After Srila Prabhupada’s physical departure these Judas disciples immediately took complete control of I.S.K.CON, it’s wealth and resources, which were intended for spreading love of Krishna. Whilst falsely declaring themselves Srila Prabhupada’s successors, they and their followers performed countless atrocious acts, including child molestation. Those who stood against them were forced out or even murdered.

This sinister movement masquerading as I.S.K.CON are now threatened to be sued for $400,000,000 by some of their victims, who were subjected to child abuse whilst at schools originally set up by Srila Prabhupada to teach the children the message of pure love of God, as proclaimed in the Vedic scriptures. Evidence used in the court case is being distorted to divert the blame on to Srila Prabhupada both by the criminals (to avoid justice) and by the victims lawyers (to gain the greatest financial rewards)

We have compiled this pamphlet in order to protect Srila Prabhupada’s spotless character and to make it clear to the public, that this cult is not the pure Hare Krishna movement founded by him, but rather a group of envious impostors in the dress of devotees. These impostors have completely neglected Srila Prabhupada’s guidance on every level, particularly in regards to protecting children.

If you are interested in learning more about these issues and the genuine Hare Krishna movement then you are welcome to contact us at prabhupada_sankirtana_society@yahoo.co.uk

We are fighting to keep the Hare Krishna movement going on with Srila Prabhupada in the centre. We are printing his original transcendental books which are now being changed by the members of this cult, against Srila Prabhupada’s order.

Every Sunday we are holding a festival of chanting and dancing and serve out a free sumptuous vegetarian feast. There is also a lecture given by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada on the science of self realisation and Bhakti Yoga, followed by a philosophical discussion. You are welcome to come along with your friends and experience the transcendental festival. HARE KRISHNA !

Here's the links to the article:

http://members.lycos.co.uk/prabhupad...p_poisoned.htm

CONTENTS

1. THE EVIDENCE - SRILA PRABHUPADA'S OWN STATEMENTS REGARDING HIS POISONING

2. SRILA PRABHUPADA TOLERANT OF HIS OWN SUFFERINGS AND MERCIFUL TO THE PEOPLE

3. THE POWER OF DEATH HAD NO INFLUENCE OVER SRILA PRABHUPADA

4. AFTER SRILA PRABHUPADA DISAPPEARS ROGUES AND NON-DEVOTEES INTRODUCE UNAUTHORIZED PRINCIPLES

5. FORENSICALLY TESTED TAPES FIND SINISTER WHISPERS OF THE JUDAS DISCIPLES IN THE ACT OF POISONING SRILA PRABHUPADA

6. 20 TIMES HIGHER THAN NORMAL ARSENIC LEVELS FOUND IN SRILA PRABHUPADA’S HAIR SAMPLES.

7. SRILA PRABHUPADA SPEAKS ABOUT CHANGING HIS BOOKS.

8. SRILA PRABHUPADA SPEAKS ABOUT THE HARE KRISHNA CHILDREN.

9. GEORGE HARRISON (EX-BEATLE) SPEAKS ABOUT SRILA PRABHUPADA.

10. THE PEACE FORMULA.




* MATERIALISTIC SCIENTISTS EXPOSED BY THE HARE KRISHNA SAINT

http://members.lycos.co.uk/spexpose/



* WHAT IS KRISHNA CONCIOUSNESS?

http://members.lycos.co.uk/prabhupad...kc/what_kc.htm



* PRABHUPADA Your ever well wisher

http://members.lycos.co.uk/prabhupada1/

[chequita guevara]

DL!!!!

[laurentius]

Welcome friend, we have been expecting you !

[BustaMike]

Woo hoo! I get to dance twice.

[Moti]

Originally posted by laurentius
Welcome friend, we have been expecting you !

Thank you brother..........


Big bang means big brain or what?


Devotee: The scientists say that everything had its origin with a big bang. All of a sudden one day there was a big bang and everything came into being.
Prabhupada: What is that big bang. You do not know. It is your suggestion. Big bang means big brain or what? Big bang? What is that, a big bang?
Devotee: Noise.
Prabhupada: Hm? (aside Don't come near. Noise? Big bang, what is that big bang?
Devotee: The scientists say that in the beginning the universe wasn't created, and then all of a sudden there was a big explosion and everything just kind of happened. Everything just came into being.
Prabhupada: But how all of a sudden there can be explosion? What is this nonsense proposition? As soon as there is question of explosion, before the explosion takes place, there must be some arrangement. The time bomb explosion. So the bomb is prepared by something, some bomb is kept by somebody, and after some time it explodes. So how all of a sudden? Where does he get this idea? Just like if there is bomb explosion here, a child may think, "All of a sudden there is a bomb explosion," but a sane man will not think that. There will be inquiry, "Who kept this bomb? Who brought this bomb?" That is sanity. "And all of a sudden explosion," this is all rascal proposal. Therefore the people have become so rascal, guided by these rascals, "All of a sudden, by chance," and they accept them as scientist... This is the drawback of the present civilization. Because they are sudras, like animals, they have got no brain to answer that "How all of a sudden there can be explosion." They have no brain even to ask. Rather, they are giving Nobel Prize. This rascal is speaking like a rascal, still, he should get Nobel Prize. That is the defect. The people at the present moment, they are all rascals. Just like animals. And yes, actually they are animals. Just like animals are eating, sleeping, mating, and eating meat. The other one animal is eating another animal. That's all. No discretion, nothing. This is a civilization of animals, polished animals. Their consciousness has become animalistic. Therefore this Krsna consciousness movement. Just like children. They are animals, just like animals. They have no fixed program. Whatever they like, they are doing. Whatever they like, they are speaking. Simply they are interested in eating. So at the present moment, because they have lost all their power of reasoning and understanding, they are all animals. "All of a sudden there is an explosion." How explosion can take place like that? Any sane human being will ask that "How is that?" Same example: If there is some explosion in the park, a rascal will say, "All of a sudden there is explosion." But the government, police department, immediately inquire, "How this bomb came? Wherefrom? Who placed it?" That is humanity. That is human reasoning. "And all of a sudden there is explosion," you have to accept that. You accept that?
Devotee: I don't accept it.
Prabhupada: Then? No sane man will accept. The so-called scientists, begin, all beginning is like that. "There were chemicals, these chemicals." Now wherefrom these chemicals came? Who placed these chemicals? They do not ask. Because they are fools, the other fools bluff them and they accept it. But we are not going to accept. We shall inquire. And that is human intelligence.
Giriraja: But they may say "Where did God come from?"
Prabhupada: No, no, God, not "come from." By experience you are speaking that things are... Just like the explosion. Explosion was there because God was there. Therefore God is there. The explosion cannot take place by chance, all of a sudden. There was somebody, some brain, and that brain is God. Because you say all of a sudden there was explosion, therefore that is the proof of existence of God. Is it clear or not?
Giriraja: Yes.
Devotee: Something can't come from nothing.
Prabhupada: No. We have no such experience. How we accept this nonsense statement? We have no such experience. I can accept something that is going on. Can you show me? So we show. You study with your experience. Where is your experience that something comes all of a sudden? There is no such thing. So how can I accept your statement? Because you say, "There was explosion," that means there is God. That means there is God. So what is your argument? You say that "Why you bring God?" I bring God because you say, "There was explosion."
Giriraja: No, you're saying that "Something cannot come from nothing."
Prabhupada: Yes.
Giriraja: So therefore this explosion came from God. But then where did God come from?
Prabhupada: That is God. God is always existing. Not "come from." That is God. Nityo nityanam. You are also existing. This knowledge, they are lacking. Just like I am, you are, we are eternal. We are eternal. We are changing body. Because they do not believe or do not try to understand that I am not this body, therefore the whole mistake is there.
Devotee: The scientists would use the same argument. The scientists would say, "Well, since I have not experienced that I am eternal, therefore how can I accept that I am eternal?"
Prabhupada: Yes, you are eternal. Because you were a child and now you are grown up, but you know that you were a child. Therefore you are eternal. You were a child, but you have no that child's body. Now you have got a different body. So although you have got different body, you know that you had a body like a child. Therefore body has changed. You have not changed. That is eternity.
Giriraja: And nobody wants to die.
Prabhupada: Nobody wants to die.
Giriraja: If the soul is not eternal, where has that desire...
Prabhupada: No. This is eternity. This is practical eternity. You have changed so many times your body, but you are the same person. Therefore you are eternal, in spite of changing body. This is simple argument.


* THE HARE KRISHNA SAINT TORTURED AND POISONED TO DEATH BY HIS JUDAS DISCIPLES

http://members.lycos.co.uk/prabhupad...p_poisoned.htm



* MATERIALISTIC SCIENTISTS EXPOSED BY THE HARE KRISHNA SAINT

http://members.lycos.co.uk/spexpose/



* WHAT IS KRISHNA CONCIOUSNESS?

http://members.lycos.co.uk/prabhupad...kc/what_kc.htm



* PRABHUPADA Your ever well wisher

http://members.lycos.co.uk/prabhupada1/

[Boris Godunov]

Ok, is 'Poly really the place for cut'n'paste prostelyzing?

Oh, and:



DL!

[rah]

Two thread limit per day.

I closed your third one.

A fourth one will lead to a restriction.

[laurentius]

Ah, americans waking up

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Yup. It's him. A single-issue cut'n'paste artist. He did CFC a few months ago, and this thread is a carbon-copy.

[chequita guevara]

Damn cultists.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

I don't think he's a cultist. I think he's a piece of software.

A Krishnabot.

[laurentius]

I love even the idea of krishna-bot

[Zevico]

Krishnabot

Danger, danger SRILA PRABHUPADA!

[molly bloom]

Oh no- barmy swami army hoodoo voodoo guru!

I'll have mango chutney, coriander and dhal with my roti, Moti.

Have a nice consciousness.

[Moti]

GEORGE HARRISON (EX BEATLE) SPEAKS ABOUT THE HARE KRISHNA SAINT. (PRABHUPADA)

Mukunda: George, you and John Lennon met Srila Prabhupada together when he stayed at John's home, in September of 1969.
George: Yes, but when I met him at first, I underestimated him. I didn't realize it then, but I see now that because of him, the mantra has spread so far in the last sixteen years, more than it had in the last five centuries. Now that's pretty amazing, because he was getting older and older, yet he was writing his books all the time. I realized later on that he was much more incredible than what you could see on the surface.

Mukunda: What about him stands out the most in your mind?

George: The thing that always stays is his saying, "I am the servant of the servant of the servant." I like that. A lot of people say, "I'm it. I'm the divine incarnation. I'm here and let me hip you." You know what I mean? But Prabhupada was never like that. I liked Prabhupada's humbleness. I always liked his humility and his simplicity The servant of the servant of the servant is really what it is, you know. None of us are God--just His servants. He just made me feel so comfortable. I always felt very relaxed with him, and I felt more like a friend. I felt that he was a good friend. Even though he was at the time seventy-nine years old, working practically all through the night, day after day, with very little sleep, he still didn't come through to me as though he was a very highly educated intellectual being, because he had a sort of childlike simplicity. Which is great, fantastic. Even though he was the greatest Sanskrit scholar and a saint, I appreciated the fact that he never made me feel uncomfortable. In fact, he always went out of his way to make me feel comfortable. I always thought of him as sort of a lovely friend, really, and now he's still a lovely friend.

Mukunda: In one of his books, Prabhupada said that your sincere service was better than some people who had delved more deeply into Krishna consciousness but could not maintain that level of commitment. How did you feel about this?

George: Very wonderful, really. I mean it really gave me hope, because as they say, even one moment in the company of a divine person, Krishna's pure devotee, can help a tremendous amount. And I think Prabhupada was really pleased at the idea that somebody from outside of the temple was helping to get the album made. Just the fact that he was pleased was encouraging to me. I knew he liked "The Hare Krishna Mantra" record, and he asked the devotees to play that song "Govinda." They still play it, don't they?

Mukunda: Every temple has a recording of it, and we play it each morning when the devotees assemble before the altar, before kirtana. It's an ISKCON institution, you might say. George: And if I didn't get feedback from Prabhupada on my songs about Krishna or the philosophy, I'd get it from the devotees. That's all the encouragement I needed really. It just seemed that anything spiritual I did, either through songs, or helping with publishing the books, or whatever, really pleased him. The song I wrote, "Living in the Material World," as I wrote in I, Me, Mine, was influenced by Srila Prabhupada. He's the one who explained to me how we're not these physical bodies. We just happen to be in them.

Like I said in the song, this place's not really what's happening. We don't belong here, but in the spiritual sky: As l'm fated for the material world, Get frustrated in the material world, Senses never gratified, Only swelling like a tide, That could drown me in the material world. The whole point to being here, really, is to figure a way to get out. That was the thing about Prabhupada, you see. He didn't just talk about loving Krishna and getting out of this place, but he was the perfect example. He talked about always chanting, and he was always chanting. I think that that in itself was perhaps the most encouraging thing for me. It was enough to make me try harder, to be just a little bit better. He was a perfect example of everything he preached.

Mukunda: How would you describe Srila Prabhupada's achievements?

George: I think Prabhupada's accomplishments are very significant; they're huge. Even compared to someone like William Shakespeare, the amount of literature Prabhupada produced is truly amazing. It boggles the mind. He sometimes went for days with only a few hours sleep. I mean even a youthful, athletic young person couldn't keep the pace he kept himself at seventy-nine years of age.

George: Srila Prabhupada has already had an amazing effect on the world. There's no way of measuring it. One day I just realized, "God, this man is amazing!" He would sit up all night translating Sanskrit into English, putting in glossaries to make sure everyone understands it, and yet he never came off as someone above you. He always had that childlike simplicity, and what's most amazing is the fact that he did all this translating in such a relatively short time--just a few years. And without having anything more than his own Krishna consciousness, he rounded up all these thousands of devotees, set the whole movement in motion, which became something so strong that it went on even after he left. And it's still escalating even now at an incredible rate. It will go on and on from the knowledge he gave. [Edititors note: Srila Prabhupada: “Even if they stop (the movement) externally, internally it will go on.”] It can only grow and grow. The more people wake up spiritually, the more they'll begin to realize the depth of what Prabhupada was saying--how much he gave.

Mukunda: Did you know that complete sets of Prabhupada's books are in all the major colleges and universities in the world, including Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Oxford, Cambridge, and the Sorbonne?

George: They should be! One of the greatest things I noticed about Prabhupada was the way he would be talking to you in English, and then all of a sudden he would say it to you in Sanskrit and then translate it back into English. It was clear that he really knew it well. His contribution has obviously been enormous from the literary point of view, because he's brought the Supreme Person, Krishna, more into focus. A lot of scholars and writers know the Gita, but only on an intellectual level. Even when they write "Krishna said...," they don't do it with the bhakti or love required. That's the secret, you know--Krishna is actually a person who is the Lord and who will also appear there in that book when there is that love, that bhakti. You can't understand the first thing about God unless you love Him. These big so-called Vedic scholars--they don't necessarily love Krishna, so they can't understand Him and give Him to us. But Prabhupada was different.

Mukunda: The Vedic literatures predicted that after the advent of Lord Caitanya five hundred years ago, there would be a Golden Age of ten thousand years, when the chanting of the holy names of God would completely nullify all the degradations of the modern age, and real spiritual peace would come to this planet.

George: Well, Prabhupada's definitely affected the world in an absolute way. What he was giving us was the highest literature, the highest knowledge. I mean there just isn't anything higher.


Mukunda: You write in your autobiography that "No matter how good you are, you still need grace to get out of the material world. You can be a yogi or a monk or a nun, but without God's grace you still can't make it." And at the end of the song "Living in the Material World," the Iyrics say, "Got to get out of this place by the Lord Sri Krishna's grace, my salvation from the material world." If we're dependent on the grace of God, what does the expression "God helps those who help themselves" mean?

George: It's flexible, I think. In one way, I'm never going to get out of here unless it's by His grace but then again, His grace is relative to the amount of desire I can manifest in myself. The amount of grace I would expect from God should be equal to the amount of grace I can gather or earn. I get out what I put in. Like in the song I wrote about Prabhupada:

The Lord loves the one that loves the Lord
And the law says if you don't give,
then you don't get loving
Now the Lord helps those that help themselves
And the law says whatever you do
It comes right back on you

-"The Lord Loves the One that Loves the Lord"

from Living in the Material World Apple LP

Have you heard that song "That Which I Have Lost" from my new album, Somewhere in England? It's right out of the Bhagavad-gita. In it I talk about fighting the forces of darkness, limitations, falsehood, and mortality.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Moti
GEORGE HARRISON (EX BEATLE) SPEAKS ABOUT THE HARE KRISHNA SAINT. (PRABHUPADA)

Don't you mean George Harrison (ex person)?

I think we can safely say he's extinct.

Are you channeling him from beyond? Perhaps you could get him to write a song, you might make some money.

[Moti]

Originally posted by molly bloom


Don't you mean George Harrison (ex person)?

I think we can safely say he's extinct.

Are you channeling him from beyond? Perhaps you could get him to write a song, you might make some money.

We can safely say your spiritual intelligence is lost at this time:

TRANSLATION

As a person puts on new garments, giving up old ones, similarly, the soul accepts new material bodies, giving up the old and useless ones.

PURPORT

Change of body by the atomic individual soul is an accepted fact. Even some of the modern scientists who do not believe in the existence of the soul, but at the same time cannot explain the source of energy from the heart, have to accept continuous changes of body which appear from childhood to boyhood and from boyhood to youth and again from youth to old age. From old age, the change is transferred to another body. This has already been explained in the previous verse.
Transference of the atomic individual soul to another body is made possible by the grace of the Supersoul. The Supersoul fulfills the desire of the atomic soul as one friend fulfills the desire of another. The Vedas, like the Mundaka Upanisad, as well as the Svetasvatara Upanisad, compare the soul and the Supersoul to two friendly birds sitting on the same tree. One of the birds (the individual atomic soul) is eating the fruit of the tree, and the other bird (Krsna) is simply watching His friend. Of these two birds--although they are the same in quality--one is captivated by the fruits of the material tree, while the other is simply witnessing the activities of His friend. Krsna is the witnessing bird, and Arjuna is the eating bird. Although they are friends, one is still the master and the other is the servant. Forgetfulness of this relationship by the atomic soul is the cause of one's changing his position from one tree to another or from one body to another. The jiva soul is struggling very hard on the tree of the material body, but as soon as he agrees to accept the other bird as the supreme spiritual master--as Arjuna agreed to do by voluntary surrender unto Krsna for instruction--the subordinate bird immediately becomes free from all lamentations. Both the Katha Upanisad and Svetasvatara Upanisad confirm this:

samane vrkse puruso nimagno
'nisaya socati muhyamanah
justam yada pasyaty anyam isam asya
mahimanam iti vita-sokah

"Although the two birds are in the same tree, the eating bird is fully engrossed with anxiety and moroseness as the enjoyer of the fruits of the tree. But if in some way or other he turns his face to his friend who is the Lord and knows His glories--at once the suffering bird becomes free from all anxieties." Arjuna has now turned his face towards his eternal friend, Krsna, and is understanding the Bhagavad-gita from Him. And thus, hearing from Krsna, he can understand the supreme glories of the Lord and be free from lamentation.
Arjuna is advised herewith by the Lord not to lament for the bodily change of his old grandfather and his teacher. He should rather be happy to kill their bodies in the righteous fight so that they may be cleansed at once of all reactions from various bodily activities. One who lays down his life on the sacrificial altar, or in the proper battlefield, is at once cleansed of bodily reactions and promoted to a higher status of life. So there was no cause for Arjuna's lamentation.

[Prabhupada from Bhagavad-gita 2.22]

[DinoDoc]

DL

[Hueij]

I miss CivNation...

[Space05us]

I dont normaly partake in the DL dance but looking at the size of those posts and my feeling generaly lazy today I'll just go with the flow.


DL!! DL!!

[Spiffor]

Krishnabot

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Moti



We can safely say your spiritual intelligence is lost at this time:

Mmm, no, I don't think so, but I am missing a biography of James Baldwin that I left on the eastbound District Line in London about six years' ago, and some amounts of small change here and there.

Perhaps they're way down upon the Swami river, what'd'ya reckon?

'Swami, how I love ya, how I love ya, my dear old Swami....I'd walk a million miles for one of your parables, my dear old Swami.'

I'm not sure, but I think I channeled that from either George Harrison or possibly an avatar of Krishna. It should be sung to the accompaniment of the veena and to the tune of 'Swannee River'.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Moti
but at the same time cannot explain the source of energy from the heart

What century are you in, Moti?

[Moti]

SRILA PRABHUPADA SPEAKS

ABOUT THE HARE KRISHNA CHILDREN



The important matter is that the

children are taken care of nicely

The important matter is that the children are taken care of nicely. Bhavananda was talking with me that in New Vrindaban students were very much neglected. Therefore they were immediately transferred to New York. Every parent wants to see that their children are taken care of very nicely. That is the first duty. If they are not healthy then how they can prosecute their education? If they are undernourished it is not good for their future activities. They must have sufficient quantity of milk and then dhal, capatis, vegetables, and a little fruit will keep them always fit. There is no need of luxurious fatty foods but milk is essential. A big building is also very good for the children's health. They can move freely and run and jump.

[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Satsvarupa Nairobi 9 October, 1971]



These children are given to us by Krishna, they are

Vaisnavas and we must be very careful to protect them.

My dear Arundhati, Please accept my blessings. I am in due receipt of your letter dated July 19, 1972, and I am simply surprised that you want to give up your child to some other persons, even they are also devotees. For you, child-worship is more important than deity-worship. If you cannot spend time with him, then stop the duties of pujari. At least you must take good care of your son until he is four years old, and if after that time you are unable any more to take care of him then I shall take care. These children are given to us by Krishna, they are Vaisnavas and we must be very careful to protect them. These are not ordinary children, they are Vaikuntha children, and we are very fortunate we can give them chance to advance further in Krishna Consciousness. That is very great responsibility, do not neglect it or be confused. Your duty is very clear. Hoping this will meet you in good health. Your ever well-wisher, A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami.

[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Arundhati Amsterdam 30 July, 1972]



Forcing will not make me agree. But if there is

love, oh, I shall gladly do it. That is bhakti,

that is Krishna Consciousness.

I am very glad to learn that the children at Gurukula school are making good progress in their Krishna Consciousness education, that is very good news. Yes, if we simply train them properly they will come out just to the highest standard of Vaisnava devotee. And what is that training? Simply they should be engaged in such a way that they are somehow or other remembering Krishna at every moment, that's all. It is not something mechanical process, if we force in such a way they will come out like this, no. We are persons, and Krishna is a Person, and our relationship with Krishna He leaves open as a voluntary agreement always, and that voluntary attitude--Yes, Krishna, I shall gladly co-operate whatever you say--that ready willingness to obey is only possible if there is love. Forcing will not make me agree. But if there is love, oh, I shall gladly do it. That is bhakti, that is Krishna Consciousness. So similarly, if we train children by developing and encouraging their propensity to love Krishna, then we shall be successful in educating them to the topmost standard. Then they shall always very happily agree to do whatever you ask them. So I have heard that there as been some beating with sticks on the children. Of course I do not know, but that should not be. You may show the stick, threaten, but better art is to somehow or other, even by tricking them, avoid this matter of force and induce them to obey out of loving spirit. That is success of disciplinary method. Hoping this meets you in good health. Your ever well-wisher, A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami.

[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Rupa Vilasa Hyderabad 18 November, 1972]



If we want them to become great devotees, then we must

educate the children with love, not in a negative way.

Regarding your question should force be used on children, no, there shall be no forcing the children to do anything. Child should not be forced. This is all nonsense. Who has devised these things? If we want them to become great devotees, then we must educate the children with love, not in a negative way. Of course, if they become naughty we may show the stick but we should never use it. Child is nonsense, so you can trick him to obey you by making some little story and the child will become cheated in the proper behavior. But never apply force, especially to his chanting and other matters of spiritual training. That will spoil him and in the future he will not like to do it if he forced.

[S.rila Prabhupada Letter to: Brahmanya Tirtha Ahmedabad 10 December 1972]



Now the thing is, children should not

be beaten at all, that I have told.

Now the thing is, children should not be beaten at all, that I have told. They should simply be shown the stick strongly. So if one cannot manage in that way then he is not fit as teacher. If a child is trained properly in Krishna Consciousness, he will never go away. That means he must have two things, love and education. So if there is beating of child, that will be difficult for him to accept in loving spirit, and when he is old enough he may want to go away--that is the danger. So why these things are going on _ marching and chanting japa, insufficient milk, too strict enforcement of time schedules, hitting the small children? Why these things are being imposed? Why they are inventing these such new things like marching and japa like army? What can I do from such a distant place? They should run and play when they are small children, not forced to chant japa, that is not the way. So I have given you the guiding principles, it is not that I must be consulted with every small detail, that is the business of the in-charge, but if no one is there who can manage in the right way, what can I do? Now if you have got the right idea how to do it, you may go there again and take some responsible post for correcting the situation, that will be your real duty, not that there is some disagreement and I go away disgusted, no. That is not Vaisnava standard. Standard should be that, never mind there is some difficulty, my spiritual master has ordered me to do like this, now let me do it, that's all.

[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Bhanutanya Hyderabad 18 November, 1972]



These children are the future hope of our Society

Now I am concerned that the Gurukula experiment should come out nicely. These children are the future hope of our Society, so it is a very important matter how we are training them in Krishna consciousness from the very childhood.

[S.P. Letter to: Satsvarupa, New York 11 April, 1973]



Gurukula is our most important project. If the children are given a Krsna Conscious education from early childhood then there is great hope for the future of the world.

[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Dayananda, Nandarani Calcutta 27 January, 1973]



The children of our devotees may live with their parents

perpetually because you are all living in the temple

and already engaged in devotional service.

So far your son leaving you, his parents, at 5 years, that is not necessary. Especially our Krishna Conscious children; they are already living in a asrama. The children of our devotees may live with their parents perpetually because you are all living in the temple and already engaged in devotional service. Other instructions are for those not engaged in Krishna Consciousness. Any family engaged in Krishna's service is living not in this material world. Such a home is considered as Vaikuntha. [the spiritual world] That is the verdict of Bhaktivinode Thakura.

[Srila Prabhupada Letter to: Indira London 15 August, 1971]

[Space05us]

howsabout you say something. give us your thoughts, you lame twit of a DL.

[Skanky Burns]

Don't feed the troll, children.

[Ramo]

Sweet, CivNation became a Hindu.

[Bosh]

all of this talk of swami is making me think of shwerma, sweet sweet glorius shwerma...

[Space05us]

silly Boshko, thats a burrito

[Urban Ranger]

Too bad this thread isn't going anywhere.