March 7, 2004, 19:46
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#1
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Posts: 3,283
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I know I'm behind with this, but it has to be said
I've now, for the first time, played C3C deep into the modern era, and gotten a pretty comprehensive look at what's new, so a few words are in order on the unit/military front.
BIG thumbs up to Atari/Breakaway for the work they did here. The Guerilla upgrade path is now more than just a throwaway to let those old swords and archers be at least nominally useful. TOW Infantry is something I'll actually put into the build queue, even with Mechanized Infantry available, as a vital part of a combined defense. It also gives a resource poor civ an avenue to a very stout defense. Flak/Mobile SAM is also a good addition, imo, though I've yet to have to use them in combat.
I like the "Wonder Units", now that I've been able to build both of them, and find Crusaders to be useful in constructing my modern era "Siegfried Line". Ancient Cav would be overpowered, if it didn't take so long to build and consolidate a force of any size of them, so good balancing job on that. The Trebuchet, obviously, is a very nice intermediate step.
If my memory isn't failing, they increased Bomber and Jet Fighter range to 10 and 9 tiles, which on a huge map is just about perfect (wasn't it 6 in PTW, with 8 for SF and 12 for SB?). Once I get the stealth aircraft, I'm sure similar kudos will be in order there as well. I like the increased transport capacity for Helicopters, but it's not a huge deal.
The biggest thumbs up goes to sea units. The curragh, with the pushing back of map and contact trading, gives a much needed early exploration avenue. Naval warfare is as fixed as I ever expected to see it. Destroyers are worth building, even after Battleships are available. Cruisers are an excellent addition, and a proper naval force can now be assembled, with a nice mix of speed, power and detection, rather than simply throwing as many Battleships out there as you can. Stealth attack for subs... beautiful, and a much needed ability for them. My only complaint is that I still wish subs had a transport capacity of one foot unit for those cloak and dagger insertion ops. Again, not a big deal (and easily edited in), but now that the AI doesn't know where my subs are, it would be nice. Of course, that may lead to problems with the AI knowing where my Marine unit is, but not the sub that's carrying it.
Now if we can just get helos basable on carriers... 
All in all, great work, guys, and thanks.
__________________
"They say if you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. But if you teach a man to fish...then he has to get a fishing license. But he doesn't have any money, so he has to get a job and enter the social security system. And he has to file taxes, and you're gonna audit the poor son of a ***** because he's not really good at math. You pull the IRS van up to his house and take everything. You take his velvet Elvis and his toothbrush and his penis pump and that all goes up for auction with the burden of proof on you because you forgot to carry the 1. All because you wanted to eat a fish, and you couldn't even cook the fish because you need a permit for an open flame."
- Doug Stanhope
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March 7, 2004, 19:48
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#2
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Posts: 3,283
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Duh, I forgot the boost given to my favorite unit... Marines. Finally, they're where they should be offensively. Throw them into some armies, with the excellent changes made there, and  . Woohoo! Amphibious landings are even more fun than before!
__________________
"They say if you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. But if you teach a man to fish...then he has to get a fishing license. But he doesn't have any money, so he has to get a job and enter the social security system. And he has to file taxes, and you're gonna audit the poor son of a ***** because he's not really good at math. You pull the IRS van up to his house and take everything. You take his velvet Elvis and his toothbrush and his penis pump and that all goes up for auction with the burden of proof on you because you forgot to carry the 1. All because you wanted to eat a fish, and you couldn't even cook the fish because you need a permit for an open flame."
- Doug Stanhope
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March 7, 2004, 20:53
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#3
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Deity
Local Time: 14:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Oviedo, Fl
Posts: 14,103
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What did you think of lethal bombing?
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March 7, 2004, 23:08
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#4
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Posts: 3,283
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Haven't had a chance to use it, other than cruise missiles (whose extended range is another nice touch I forgot to mention). Is it air units with lethal sea bombard or something else you're referring to?
In general, anything that gives me more options for sculpting a military, rather than just piling out MA's and battleships, is a welcome change.
__________________
"They say if you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. But if you teach a man to fish...then he has to get a fishing license. But he doesn't have any money, so he has to get a job and enter the social security system. And he has to file taxes, and you're gonna audit the poor son of a ***** because he's not really good at math. You pull the IRS van up to his house and take everything. You take his velvet Elvis and his toothbrush and his penis pump and that all goes up for auction with the burden of proof on you because you forgot to carry the 1. All because you wanted to eat a fish, and you couldn't even cook the fish because you need a permit for an open flame."
- Doug Stanhope
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March 7, 2004, 23:11
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#5
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Deity
Local Time: 14:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Oviedo, Fl
Posts: 14,103
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Air.
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March 7, 2004, 23:45
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#6
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Posts: 3,283
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Saw that when your post promtped a Civilopedia check. Unless there's something I'm not anticipating that makes it broken, I think it's a good idea, and expect to enjoy it.
__________________
"They say if you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. But if you teach a man to fish...then he has to get a fishing license. But he doesn't have any money, so he has to get a job and enter the social security system. And he has to file taxes, and you're gonna audit the poor son of a ***** because he's not really good at math. You pull the IRS van up to his house and take everything. You take his velvet Elvis and his toothbrush and his penis pump and that all goes up for auction with the burden of proof on you because you forgot to carry the 1. All because you wanted to eat a fish, and you couldn't even cook the fish because you need a permit for an open flame."
- Doug Stanhope
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March 8, 2004, 01:30
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#7
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Deity
Local Time: 14:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Oviedo, Fl
Posts: 14,103
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You may not enjoy it when you are on the wrong end of it. 
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March 8, 2004, 08:25
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#8
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Warlord
Local Time: 06:52
Local Date: November 3, 2010
Join Date: May 2002
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 266
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Don't worry you aren't slow. I'm currently playing a game thats just into the first quarter of the modern age. I'm planning on playing this one out to discover, as you have, the hidden (for me) joys. I have only played one other game almost this far.
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March 8, 2004, 09:44
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#9
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Posts: 3,283
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Quote:
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Originally posted by vmxa1
You may not enjoy it when you are on the wrong end of it.
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LOL, hopefully, I'll shake my head, smile and think "Wow, how cool is it that the AI can effectively use bombardment now!"
__________________
"They say if you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. But if you teach a man to fish...then he has to get a fishing license. But he doesn't have any money, so he has to get a job and enter the social security system. And he has to file taxes, and you're gonna audit the poor son of a ***** because he's not really good at math. You pull the IRS van up to his house and take everything. You take his velvet Elvis and his toothbrush and his penis pump and that all goes up for auction with the burden of proof on you because you forgot to carry the 1. All because you wanted to eat a fish, and you couldn't even cook the fish because you need a permit for an open flame."
- Doug Stanhope
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March 8, 2004, 21:32
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#10
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Deity
Local Time: 04:52
Local Date: November 3, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Between Coast and Mountains
Posts: 14,475
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lethal bombardment has certianly been very useuful love it
__________________
GM of MAFIA #40 ,#41, #43, #45,#47,#49-#51,#53-#58,#61,#68,#70, #71
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March 9, 2004, 19:58
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#11
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:52
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Posts: 3,283
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I started a "reload war" on a Persian galleon/frigate stack that was in German waters last night, so I could test stealth attack and lethal bombardment. (Insert drooling Homer Simpson sound here).
I love both of them. A sub and pair of stealth bombers... no muss, no fuss (and no stack, either  ).
__________________
"They say if you give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day. But if you teach a man to fish...then he has to get a fishing license. But he doesn't have any money, so he has to get a job and enter the social security system. And he has to file taxes, and you're gonna audit the poor son of a ***** because he's not really good at math. You pull the IRS van up to his house and take everything. You take his velvet Elvis and his toothbrush and his penis pump and that all goes up for auction with the burden of proof on you because you forgot to carry the 1. All because you wanted to eat a fish, and you couldn't even cook the fish because you need a permit for an open flame."
- Doug Stanhope
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