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Old March 7, 2004, 20:46   #1
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Turn 2159
Turn 2159 is here.

I don't know why Buster rushed his turn.

I just took a look and so far see:

Data Angles have once again invaded our homeland.
An Impact Marines infantry (green) is just south of New Moscow.
An Impact Rover (Disciplined) is southwest of New Moscow.
An empty Transport Foils is two squares east of New Moscow.
I will deal with them with a nearby chopper. (My chopper may well be Veteran, as a result, by the end of this turn)


I have not moved the F-15 so I don't know where the Captured(?) former Peace CP is. I will return the F-15 to New Moscow and may discover its whereabouts.

I will empty the Data Angles garrison at Coneshelf57 with a chopper (probably)


University has zero (0) energy reserves so it will have trouble buying any of our units unless it scraps some units or facilities (or gets cash from CyCon).

Please everyone take a look and give me some suggestions.

At Hong Hu's request, I will serve as turnplayer this turn.

I want input and discussion before I take any actions that are irreversible.


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Old March 7, 2004, 20:58   #2
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Do we have a green light for millitary action vs CyUni?

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Old March 7, 2004, 21:36   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jamski
Do we have a green light for millitary action vs CyUni?

-Jam
No, and I have to think really hard before we do so.

I really wanted the Drones to do a recon of the area surronding Longreach before we took it. Without the benefit of their recon it may be too hard to accomplish safely.

On the other hand, if we see the CP they took from Peace on the island we are killing it.

Plus, if there are any, ANY, CyCon units within range either to threaten the us or Peace we are killing them.


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Old March 7, 2004, 22:42   #4
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I recommend holding the save long enough to check with buster on timing of the attacks, at least.
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Old March 7, 2004, 23:29   #5
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Buster didn't rush his turn particularly this turn. His turn time has always been very short (about 8 hours in average). I will take a look at the turn right now. I agree with Comrade Mead that if the Drones did not start their strike at univ we should not hurry in ourselves. However we should not be hesitating to declare war if we see any CPU units around us.
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Old March 7, 2004, 23:47   #6
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Buster's posted their preparation here. He is very considerate. He has sent a jet to serve as the air cover of our advanced troops.
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Old March 8, 2004, 00:15   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by HongHu
Buster's posted their preparation here. He is very considerate. He has sent a jet to serve as the air cover of our advanced troops.
I am going to see what I can do about an invasion of Longreach as well as preposition choppers for the plan Buster has.

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Old March 8, 2004, 01:09   #8
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I have looked at our turn a little. We will be able to send 3 apaches and 1 skyhawk as the advanced troop. Buster's jet seems to be rather close to the enemy I think, if we go there we need to be very careful don't misclick so one of our planes goes to close to the enemy base.
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Old March 8, 2004, 01:19   #9
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For attacking longreach next turn we will have 3 choppers ready as well as the other units (2 drop rover, 3 drop probe and 3 drop garrison). Two apachies would be tight up in the east front. One apachy I think does not have enough movement to freeman.

Suggest rush build another two apachy in Mead and Vev.

We have finished researching Int Int. Suggest reseach Planetary economics. Also design police unit. SU needs to upgrade the scout to police.

East front, suggest using the skyhawk to cover peace schooner (not the transport). Googlie has a Apache that we can use to empty conshlf57. Kozzimacity has a damaged Apache that can be used to kill the Roze rover and transport, perhaps as well as the infantry. The skyhawk that needs to come back can go to new moscow and I think it will still have 1 or 2 movement left so if needed can be used to kill the roze infantry.
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Old March 8, 2004, 01:20   #10
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Also suggest rush the transport and move the probe and garison to new moscow ready to be sent out.
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Old March 8, 2004, 01:24   #11
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Borehold beside Franky is finished. The formers can be sent to (22,34) to build a sensor. Since the formers will not be able to reach it there, suggest only move a couple to build a road next turn, and the others accumulate teraforming first.

Roko has a borehole finished also. The crawlers and workers needs to be rearranged.

Also suggest Honghu Konghu use the borehole besides it to finish the biocenter sooner. Otherwise it is not going to be too much useful.
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Old March 8, 2004, 02:16   #12
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Thank you Hong Hu
Quote:
Originally posted by HongHu
Borehold beside Franky is finished. The formers can be sent to (22,34) to build a sensor. Since the formers will not be able to reach it there, suggest only move a couple to build a road next turn, and the others accumulate teraforming first.

Roko has a borehole finished also. The crawlers and workers needs to be rearranged.

Also suggest Honghu Konghu use the borehole besides it to finish the biocenter sooner. Otherwise it is not going to be too much useful.
Hong Hu

I really appreciate the assistance with this.

As you know I cannot move the formers or crawlers aroung and then discover I made a mistake.

Please give exact, detailed, instructions for me to follow on the Former and Crawler moves.

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Old March 8, 2004, 02:35   #13
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Busted posted the turn to us at 17:46 on 7-3-2004

It is now ~01:35 on 8-3-2004.

I will be back on-line in about 18 hours (or about 19:25 on 8-3-2004)

We have until 17:46 on 9-3-2004 to post our turn.

I have posted what I want to build in the save I uploaded.

We have 157 ECs
I intend to rush as many units that will be ready for use next turn.

The following bases I expect to rush:

Vevtopia - Apache

Jamski's Remption - Rec Tanks

Zeroplis - Drop Plasma + ??? to roll over 10 minerals

Hong Hu Kong Hu - Bio Center + ??? to roll over 10 mins (I want to get it producing high morale air units starting 2161)

New Moscow - Destroyer Transport

I'm not doing any rushes, or moving any more units (or starting the war) until I log back on-line about 19:25 on 8-3-2004.

Please review my save, my plan, and offer your observations and comments before then.

I would really like a detailed list of how much to rush each thing to get maximum benefit for rolling over minerals.


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Old March 8, 2004, 04:21   #14
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Central Military Committee Report, M.Y. 2159:

Issue - University Invasion:
All Chopper class aircraft within reach should advance to Free Drone Aircraft guarded xenofungus patch within University territory. IMPORTANT: Be careful to ensure that all remaining fuel is used upon entering the patch--otherwise the pilots may try to return home immediately! No gound troops are to airdrop behind enemy lines until next year! To this, station all available ground invasion forces in Freedman Park. The invasion shall start next year! Do NOT engage any units--or we'll lose the element of surprise (which is still intact)!

Issue - Data Angels:
Dispatch Chopper class aircraft from Googliegrad and take out the Data Angel rover. Eliminate the transport foil and then take out the infantry unit. Return to New Moscow for refueling.
Our production planning during M.Y. 2158 has been a disaster! Our airforce is highly inadequate and our reconnaissance is non-existent. Focus on airdrop troops (20%) and aircraft (70%). We are going to war and base facilities in production should be either suspended, changed or hurried immediately!
Conshelf57 might not be available for PEACE invasion--even if we relieve the base of all defenders. A probe is required to disable all current production at the base--which might be difficult to accomplish. So, unless we have a base stationed aircraft available for eliminating the defenses at Conshelf57 we may risk the aircraft already dispatched east of the base; but ONLY if we have a probe available for the production sabotage.
The Needlejet class aircraft at Rokossovkygrad should fly to [28,44] to protect the PEACE invasion foil. The aircraft may--while in transit for the destination--scout for the CyCon colony pod on the eastern part of the small island.

Issue - CyCon Colony Pod:
We may use the nearby cruiser class vessel to scout for CyCon transports (northwest, west or southwest). Any CyCon transports holding a colony pod should be destroyed. However, the colony pod is still presumed to be on the small island and the nearby aircraft [35,41] should search the central part of this island. Depending on the location of the colony pod (if it is indeed still on the island) the aircraft at Kommuniza City should be designated the task of eliminating the colony pod. The aircraft should crash afterwards, preferably in a xenofungus patch. If the colony pod is not on the island it should pose no risk to our security and all aircraft may return to bases.
We are probably in a state of vendetta against the CyCon if we manage to locate the colony pod. This is approved by the Central Military Committee.

Issue - Internal Planning:
Upgrade specific infantry garrisons to police units if required. Focus mainly on aircraft production. Frankyburg should be considered designated colony pod production. However, aiding PEACE defensively should also be considered.

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Old March 8, 2004, 21:33   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rubin
Central Military Committee Report, M.Y. 2159:

Issue - University Invasion:
All Chopper class aircraft within reach should advance to Free Drone Aircraft guarded xenofungus patch within University territory. IMPORTANT: Be careful to ensure that all remaining fuel is used upon entering the patch--otherwise the pilots may try to return home immediately! No gound troops are to airdrop behind enemy lines until next year! To this, station all available ground invasion forces in Freedman Park. The invasion shall start next year! Do NOT engage any units--or we'll lose the element of surprise (which is still intact)!
I am not sure it still is. Plus once we fly by those Uni troops they will know we are on the way.

I am not that worried if CyCon knows we are coming.
I do not think they will destroy all of Uni. And if they do, it will deprive the Drones, not us of the majority of the pickings, plus deprive CyCon of MMI.

Quote:

Issue - Data Angels:
Dispatch Chopper class aircraft from Googliegrad and take out the Data Angel rover. Eliminate the transport foil and then take out the infantry unit. Return to New Moscow for refueling.
I want to use that chopper to empty Conshelf57.

The Needlejet next to the CyCon CP needs to return to New Moscow this turn. It can destroy the Data Angle Infantry once it gets to New Moscow (it will still have movement points left in it, and if it attacks the infantry while the jet is parked over the city the jet will not crash upon finishing the attack.

Quote:
Our production planning during M.Y. 2158 has been a disaster! Our airforce is highly inadequate and our reconnaissance is non-existent. Focus on airdrop troops (20%) and aircraft (70%). We are going to war and base facilities in production should be either suspended, changed or hurried immediately!
Please see my posts on this matter.

Quote:
Conshelf57 might not be available for PEACE invasion--even if we relieve the base of all defenders. A probe is required to disable all current production at the base--which might be difficult to accomplish. So, unless we have a base stationed aircraft available for eliminating the defenses at Conshelf57 we may risk the aircraft already dispatched east of the base; but ONLY if we have a probe available for the production sabotage.
We don't have a probe and will not have one in place for at least 2 or 3 turns (too late)

Quote:
The Needlejet class aircraft at Rokossovkygrad should fly to [28,44] to protect the PEACE invasion foil.
I wanted to use it for that, but now since I found the CP I want that one to Kill the CP.

Quote:
The aircraft may--while in transit for the destination--scout for the CyCon colony pod on the eastern part of the small island.
Already found in the interior of the island by needlejet returning to New Moscow.

Quote:

Issue - CyCon Colony Pod:
We may use the nearby cruiser class vessel to scout for CyCon transports (northwest, west or southwest). Any CyCon transports holding a colony pod should be destroyed. However, the colony pod is still presumed to be on the small island and the nearby aircraft [35,41] should search the central part of this island. Depending on the location of the colony pod (if it is indeed still on the island) the aircraft at Kommuniza City should be designated the task of eliminating the colony pod. The aircraft should crash afterwards, preferably in a xenofungus patch. If the colony pod is not on the island it should pose no risk to our security and all aircraft may return to bases.
We are probably in a state of vendetta against the CyCon if we manage to locate the colony pod. This is approved by the Central Military Committee.
CP found and War Will begin.

Quote:
Issue - Internal Planning:
Upgrade specific infantry garrisons to police units if required. Focus mainly on aircraft production. Frankyburg should be considered designated colony pod production. However, aiding PEACE defensively should also be considered.
Please see:

http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php...DG-Hive2159.SAV

Which I posted last night for people's review and comment. I heavily focused on aviation.



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Old March 8, 2004, 21:45   #16
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What will be our opening attack? Are we going to just attack the CP first, or are we going to go 'all-out'?


As Foreman Buster has said, this all comes down to us being spotted. Is there a contingency if our forces ARE spotted, or will we just go on ahead?

Lastly, I'm a little confused on where our focus is in the matter of war. It seems like half of us are concentrating on the Data Angels elimination, half are concentrating on the Drone/Hive invasion of the University territories, and a few of us are looking at the invasion of the CyCon homeland...with PEACE's survival as an afterthought. Our forces aren't unlimited and I just want to know where we will be focusing the bulk of our units.

So far it seems that we are concentrating on the Data Angels. Is this true, and if not, can I get a summary of what we will be contributing to the Drone/Hive invasion of the University?
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Old March 8, 2004, 22:07   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frankychan
What will be our opening attack? Are we going to just attack the CP first, or are we going to go 'all-out'?


***
I will post what I intend to do this turn in THIS THREAD, over the next 20-30 minutes.

IF THERE IS NOT COMPLETE OPPOSITION OR ORDERS FROM VOLTAIRE TO NOT DO IT I WILL PLAN IT AS INDICATE HERE.

I will take into considerations and may modify my plan of action based upon inputs from other players.


I WILL, HOWEVER, PLAY AND POST THE TURN WITHIN TWO HOURS.

It will be on my shoulders, the success or failure of the Hive this turn, and baring my being relieved of duties I will make the final call and post I judge best.

Mead


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Old March 8, 2004, 22:12   #18
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whoa whoa whoa, sorry if I offended you Comrade.

I have full confidence that you will begin the Hive's ascent to glory this turn and send a message to the CPU that they're ramblings of cybernetic perfection are nothing more than useless drivel.

Good luck
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Old March 8, 2004, 22:27   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frankychan
whoa whoa whoa, sorry if I offended you Comrade.

I have full confidence that you will begin the Hive's ascent to glory this turn and send a message to the CPU that they're ramblings of cybernetic perfection are nothing more than useless drivel.

Good luck
Frankychan

It's OK.

You did not offend me and I didn't think you intended an offense.

Please review and comment on the postings I will make here. Please review the save I posted last night, I'll post it again here.

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Old March 8, 2004, 22:33   #20
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THE WAR PLAN
It's bold. It's decisive. It's listed below for all of you to review and give me your opinions.



Battle plan for Eastern Theater of Operations.

As you can see in the save I have moved our ships west to better protect them and to provide a screen for Peace.

We have three problems in the East.

1. Deal with the Data Angle Invasion
2. Kill the CyCon Colony Pod before it makes a base.
3. Empty Conshelf57 for Peace

We deal with the invasion as follows.
1. Needlejet that is next to CyCon CP returns to New Moscow. It Kills Data Angle 4~1,1 infantry adjacent to New Moscow

2. We Launch (40% damaged) Apache out of Kommunzia City. It Kills Data Angel Impact Rover, and then (if healthy enough, which it should be still) Kills Data Angle transport, then it lands in New Moscow.

3. We Launch Skyhawk out of Rokossovkygrad. It Kills CyCon CP.
4. We Launch Apache out of Googligrad. It attacks and empties Conshelf57. It must land on the water. Hopefully it lives.





Battle Plan Western Theater of Operations


This is the plan to take and hold Longreach.

Knowns:
Buster Has already scouted out some of the Fungus for us.

Longreach is garrison with: 1-2t-1 and 0-1-1 probe.

There is an Uni Infantry Unit SE of Longreach and a Uni Transport off its nearby coast.

Uni has one interceptor supported by Caboolture but either in the air or at a CyCon base.

There are no aircraft in any of the Uni's bases.

Gardens Point will have a needlejet read next turn.

My suggestion:

Launch Skyhawk out of Freedman's Park, recon area north of Longreach, kill any probes found, ensure turn ends on 86,30 to seal off Uni access to Longreach using either road or river (risk they may use their interceptor on a suicide mission to clear way fro probes.

Launch one chopper out of Freedman's Park it recons the southern (if Buster did not already for us, I'll check) fungus, kills the SE Uni infantry and empties the garrison of Longreach.

Launch second chopper out of Freedman's Park recon fungus northwest of Longreach, Kills any units within.

Drop both 1~3-1 Infantry into Longreach.

Land choppers in Longreach.

Land Choppers from Anvil of Man in Longreach.

Move up the other units that cannot make it to Longreach to Freedman's Park for the second wave.


Buster's reply to my plan of attack.
Quote:
If you are talking about starting the actual attack now - yes I believe the plan will work.

However - I believe cycon may opt to destroy a large part of the uni territory in order to buy time. (Scorched earth tactics).
Waiting till next turn means we can empty 8 cities (townsville, cape york, daintree, kelvin grove, gold coast, carseldine, sunshine coast and longreach) effectively preventing them from destroying these.

We will be taking some of these (probably at least three or four can be taken safely) and so be in reach of the remaining.

Going now can probably probably be done safely - though some of the choppers you will leave hanging around may be taken out by ground units. That is a lot we can easily manage though and not itself a problem.

Shortly - yes it is probably safe but will likely give you a few extra casualties.

My main concern is not so much the safety of the attack but the fact they may opt to destroy the bases they believe to be exposed and then go to Gas warfare - which could make it hard to hold Longreach (one hot by a gasplane will wipe the base).

On waiting and hitting the next row of bases simultaneously we are effectively robbing them of the chance to selfdestroy (as they cannot destroy empty bases - it requires a millitary unit inside). Danger is of course they spot our units and selfdestroy the closest bases before we even get the chance to take one of them (in which case we will need to drop in a cp to get in range).

Now if they spot our (drones) advance party - I will claim they are heading towards pirates to assist them. They may well believe that. However if they spot your units they cannot be explained away.

I believe however chances of being spotted are very small. I don't see any reason the plane should be coming that way from Gardens Point and that is the only chance of exposure I can imagine.

I will leave the decision to you. You could go now as outlined. The danger is not much that it will it will fail (I am quite sure you would be able to take and hold the base) I am more concerned about their destroying own bases.

Of course that in effect means they have lost the game (which in fact they had already when they got into their fight with Pirates even if they may not realize it) but it could delay the end quite a bit as we will need to build our way to Cycon territory rather than being able to use Uni bases to get there and once Cycon is without trading partners there is no reason for them not to gas-equip all their units - making defending newly built bases near their homeground complicated.

It all comes down to the chance of being spotted. If we are spotted it would better we had at least taken one base. If we are not we are better off waiting.
When we fly by the Uni forces it is likely we will be spotted.

If CyCon destroys Uni's bases it loses MMI and deprives Drones of most of the bases not us.

Our attack will distract CyCon from the Drones action up north.

Although w do not need Buster's permission to attack this turn he has said he is OK with it.


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Old March 8, 2004, 22:46   #21
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Hmmm, the general plan looks good. I would be careful to the exact placement of our units. While I cannot see the exact location of these units, please try to use ZOC's as effective as possible.

I fear that they CyCon may view the loss of MMI reasonable if they can deprive the Drones of those bases...but we just have to make sure that THAT does not happen.

Quote:
Needlejet that is next to CyCon CP returns to New Moscow. It Kills Data Angle 4~1,1 infantry adjacent to New Moscow
Do you mean to do this all in one turn? From my personal experience, any jet that returns to a base usually cannot attack a unit next to the base its located in....but sometimes I can. WTH is up with that? But I digress...

While I have confidence in Foreman Busters plan, I highly doubt that they will believe that the Drones are sending aid to PEACE. Considering all the hostile rhetoric in the public forum, it's most likely that they will see this as an act of war and will be prepared.

Things are otherwise looking good. So, regardless of what we do THIS turn, the Drones will act NEXT turn, right? The Drone embassy looks like he's planning this, but I just want to be sure.
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Old March 8, 2004, 22:55   #22
Mead
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Production Planning and Rushing for 2159
See my posted save to see what I am planning to build.

We have 157 ECs

There are no new facilites started this turn.

I am rushing Voltriograd Rec Tanks - need 24 EC, (12 min)

Meadopolis 2~1-2 Laser Rover (costs the same as a 1~1-2 rover) - 28 EC (11 min)

Vevtopia Apache - need 52 EC (10 min)

Jamski's Remption Rec Tanks - need 30 EC (10 min)

Hong Hu Kong Hu - Need 64 (8 min, but may have more if put a worker on a borehole). I want this bio center base producing high morale units starting no later than 2161

Zeropolis - Need 16 (7 min)

I will not overrush (to get 10 min carryover) all of the above, but will try to rush them all to ensure they produce a unit next turn.

Note: I will not rush the transport this turn because I have little to put on it next turn.

I will try to have about 50 ECs at the end of the turn.

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Old March 8, 2004, 23:05   #23
Mead
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frankychan

***

Do you mean to do this all in one turn? From my personal experience, any jet that returns to a base usually cannot attack a unit next to the base its located in....but sometimes I can. WTH is up with that? But I digress...
Usually when an airplane (chopper too) returns to a base, its turn ends. But, if there is an enemy unit immediately next to that base and the aviation unit has movement points left in it, the plane will remain active, allowing you to use it to attack that enemy unit in th space next door. Ifour needlejet was not over a base it could still attack the enemy unit on the trip back to base and kill that enemy unit, but the needlejet would run out of fuel and crash.

I will make that my first move, just in case it does not work that way, so the other aviation units nearby can handle the invasion just in case.

Quote:
***
Things are otherwise looking good. So, regardless of what we do THIS turn, the Drones will act NEXT turn, right? The Drone embassy looks like he's planning this, but I just want to be sure.
That's what he says he doing.

My biggest concern is that I won't be able to park a needlejet on top of tha Peace schooner.


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Old March 8, 2004, 23:05   #24
Frankychan
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It's says that the page is missing...
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Old March 8, 2004, 23:07   #25
Mead
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frankychan
It's says that the page is missing...
http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php?...G-Hive2159.SAV


Try this.
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Old March 8, 2004, 23:15   #26
Frankychan
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Are you sure I can view this? I have "C" not "X".
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Old March 8, 2004, 23:18   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frankychan
Are you sure I can view this? I have "C" not "X".
No. You need SMAX.


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Old March 8, 2004, 23:19   #28
Frankychan
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BLARRRGH!!!!

Dammit, well....I guess I'm screwed.

Thanks anyway.
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Old March 8, 2004, 23:22   #29
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After I run the turn, I will post the save and seek comments before I press End Turn and Post it in the Turn Thread.


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Old March 9, 2004, 00:05   #30
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I will look at the turn right now. My biggest concern is still that you are planning to go solo on uni attack. We didn't have the immediate need for this. We would not be able to continue to wipe out the other bases in the next turn. In addition, Voltaire had appointed Rubin to be in charge of CMC and he was supposed to be the final decision maker regarding all military issues. If you feel strongly that we must attack Uni territory this turn I would like to hear more of your thought.
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