Early Warfare

Novi Nomad · July 19, 2000, 13:51

I am pondering the merits of trying to take out a civilization early. In a game I'm currently playing, I find myself on a medium continent right between the Zulu's and the Vikings.

I was able to build the hanging gardens, colossus and copernicus in my capital before running into either of them. The Zulu's immediately snuck attacked me. I made peace with the Vikings, but they promptly did a sneak attack on me as well. I've managed to spearhead through to the Zulu capital, but in doing so, I wasn't able to get Leonardo's because I was too busy building military units and didn't get invention in time. Would it have been better to avoid war altogether and perhaps strike out for a new continent? I did get Sun Tzu's after Leo's was gone, and am fairly far ahead of everone else militarily...

Also, I make peace with the Vikings every couple of turns because I don't want a war on two fronts, but they keep showing up with 5 or six chariots and trying to sneak attack me a couple of turns later. What is the deal with this? I'm beginning to really dislike the Vikings.

jpk · July 19, 2000, 14:11

Novi Nomad:

The deal is that you may have to fight a war on two fronts.

Since you seem to be doing well against the Zulu's I would go after the Zulu capital and then reduce that empire to a small number of cities. While this was going on I would try to hold off the Vikings as best as possible. Try to keep the peace but have the cities near the Vikings stocked with good defensive units. As the military advisor says, "BUILD CITY WALLS." At least in the cities nearest the Vikings. Sun Tzu makes your units veterans but you might also consider building barracks in the cities nearest the Vikings. Helps the recovery process.

If there is a mountain or other good defensive terrain square between you and the Vikings build a fortress on that square and stock it with a few defensive units. Use that fortress as a unit drain for the inevitable war. When you locate a site for this fortress try to choose one that requires the Viking land units to go next to it. They Vikings may not like the idea of you building a fortress. Prework your settlers so they can rapidly build the fortress.

Preworking a settler means having it work a piece of land but moving it prior to actual construction. When it starts working a new square all the old turns of working are applied to the new square. I don't know how many turns you will need for building a moountain fortress. Perhaps someone else can provide a better description.

inca911 · July 19, 2000, 15:32

Well, here's my opinion:
If either neighbor has built Leo's, then that's the neighbor you want to attack first because you can capture Leo's and benefit greatly. That would be my first goal if possible and I would give tribute to avoid warring with anyone but the Leo's owner to achieve that goal.
Other than that, my approach would be largely dictated by the terrain. If you cannot establish a defensive front with the Zulus, then you must attack the Zulus and count on your defensive fortifications to hold off the Vikes (or vice versa). The AI should not be able to capture a well defended city in the early game. The firepower just isn't there in early units. You might want to build a city with forests (or other low movement, minimal defensive bonus terrain) in between you and your enemy. This way you can have an offensive unit like an Elephant stomp any opp units before they get a chance to attack and you can benefit from city walls/barracks and terrain bonus in case the terrain is wide open. A mountain city with walls would be optimal but often not acquirable in a good chokepoint. Either way, if you are playing on Deity, you don't want to fight a two front war, you want to fight a one front war and let the other strategically-poor AI waste his army on your defenses. That is a battle you can definitely win!
And if you choose to fortify units outside the city and let them hold their position against the enemy, remember to stack 2 units minimum to avoid losing your Fortified, Fortressed, Vet Pikeman on a Mountain to a lowly AI Diplo bribe.

Smash · July 19, 2000, 18:43

...and am fairly far ahead of everyone else militarily...

Looks like your destiny has been chosen for you.

geofelt · July 20, 2000, 15:50

Since you are ahead in science and military, you must expect the AI to try and even things up. You must now forge ahead on your economy. This means more cities, either by building them or capturing them. I would suggest using your military to capture cities from your weaker oponnent. If this is not easy, start some new colonies on another continent and set up trade routes between the continents. Actually, try to do both. Don't worry about losing leo's. No wonder is essential, you just change your tactics.

Scouse Gits · July 20, 2000, 20:08

With both the HG and Colossus in the capital, re-homing caravans should be profitable. (I assume the city is celebrating). You are in a war situation sandwiched between two aggressive nations, so you need a healthy treasury. Build some caravans, but before you send them out (ideally to an AI on another continent), support them from your capital first.
---------
SG (2)

Caesar Jon · July 20, 2000, 20:50

This has happened to me a lot. I always try to eliminate any civ next to me early in the game. Elephants do a great job against phalanx. Just remember all the civs are going to hate you anyway so you have nothing to loose by killing a few of them off early.

cavebear · July 20, 2000, 21:26

Against the AI, build a city between you and the AI. Set it up on a hill or mountain with 2 settlers (one to mine it and the other to build the city after the mining *starts*).

The defensive units are nearly impossible to kill by the AI, and it will spend all its time trying to do that. In a current game, I have a city that started with a phalanx, a pikesman, and a chariot. It has been improved through Leo's, but I haven't added a single unit to it by movement or building. It has killed off a dozen chariots, about the same in elephants and catapaults and cavalry, and is currently a death-trap for alpines and marines.

Those 3 initial units have probably killed 100 offensive units, and the city is producing trade and caravans (for Wonders) out the wazoo!

------------------
Proud participant in GameLeague...

Proud Warrior of the O.W.L. Alliance...