July 20, 2001, 16:40
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#91
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:29
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Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Antwerp, Colon's Chocolate Canard Country
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Markos, regarding that figure of 90,000 unique visitors, I'm not sure what constitutes a "unique visitor" and how those stats are compiled. Care to explain?
I'm asking this (aside from plain curiosity) because I find it hard to believe over a million individuals visited Apolyton the past 12 months.
Besides, (in reply to Senowen) not all of those are potential customers so the impact Apolyton has is probably a lot less than that figure wouls suggest.
Another question (back to Markos again), has news from Apolyton (and/or its boards) ever been quoted in game mags or sites?
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DISCLAIMER: the author of the above written texts does not warrant or assume any legal liability or responsibility for any offence and insult; disrespect, arrogance and related forms of demeaning behaviour; discrimination based on race, gender, age, income class, body mass, living area, political voting-record, football fan-ship and musical preference; insensitivity towards material, emotional or spiritual distress; and attempted emotional or financial black-mailing, skirt-chasing or death-threats perceived by the reader of the said written texts.
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July 20, 2001, 18:16
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#92
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Apolyton CS Co-Founder
Local Time: 13:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Macedonia, Greece
Posts: 24,480
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Colon
Markos, regarding that figure of 90,000 unique visitors, I'm not sure what constitutes a "unique visitor" and how those stats are compiled. Care to explain?
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let me quote
This displays the total number of individual visitors who used one browser application to view your site one time within a 30-day period.
you can see these stats at hitbox
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I'm asking this (aside from plain curiosity) because I find it hard to believe over a million individuals visited Apolyton the past 12 months.
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it's obvious that in the period of one year the number will be smaller that 90kx12 cause some people visit more regularly
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Another question (back to Markos again), has news from Apolyton (and/or its boards) ever been quoted in game mags or sites?
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we've had some mentions in magazines from time to time...
http://apolyton.net/about/rec.shtml
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July 20, 2001, 18:44
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#93
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King
Local Time: 04:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,747
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Out of the visitors doesn't it only matter about the people who pay attention to the Civ3 stuff? I think it should be configured on who are the Civ3 visitors and not all of the sites visitors. Unless these numbers are coming from the Civ3 portion of the site and not the whole site combined.
The reason I'm saying this is because the only people Firaxis should care about here, in Civ3 terms, are the Civ3 visitors.
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However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.
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July 20, 2001, 21:04
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#94
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King
Local Time: 06:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Hope College
Posts: 2,232
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Originally posted by TechWins
Out of the visitors doesn't it only matter about the people who pay attention to the Civ3 stuff? I think it should be configured on who are the Civ3 visitors and not all of the sites visitors. Unless these numbers are coming from the Civ3 portion of the site and not the whole site combined.
The reason I'm saying this is because the only people Firaxis should care about here, in Civ3 terms, are the Civ3 visitors.
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Except others that are here are here for a reason - Civ. If they bought CTP or SMAC in the past then there is a good chance they will buy another civ game. So everyone that visits here, even the OTF posters, came here for at least the first time for Civ.
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July 20, 2001, 21:19
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#95
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King
Local Time: 04:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Arizona
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Except others that are here are here for a reason - Civ. If they bought CTP or SMAC in the past then there is a good chance they will buy another civ game. So everyone that visits here, even the OTF posters, came here for at least the first time for Civ.
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If there are 90,000 visitors for this site, then how many of those visitors are for the civ3 portion of the site? If 90,000 of them do look at the civ3 portion than there are about 15% of Firaxis possibly soon to be customers here. If that is the case Firaxis should be giving us great treatment here. Since I doubt all 90,000 care about the civ3 site than less than 15% of Firaxis possibly soon to be customers are here at Apolyton. That's not say that the other visitors won't buy Civ3 it's just right now Firaxis doesn't need to cater for 90,000 (15% possible customers) visitors. I believe that less than 10% of Firaxis' possible customers are here at Apolyton, which means that Firaxis doesn't need to go to great lenghts to make people here happy. I hope you understand what I mean now.
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However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.
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July 20, 2001, 21:36
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#96
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Local Time: 06:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 6,135
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did dan ever answer the question originally posted? or are we all just sad people who can't wait for the answer talking in a thread meant to be a question for one person?
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July 20, 2001, 21:58
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#97
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King
Local Time: 04:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,747
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did dan ever answer the question originally posted? or are we all just sad people who can't wait for the answer talking in a thread meant to be a question for one person?
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No, he never posted the question. I'm not really anticipating a post by Dan. In fact I'm not really anticipating anything from Firaxis. I'm just going to take things as they come. Kind of like how I want Civ3 to come out before Chirstmas but if they can't get the game out that early, with the game not being poor, I'll wait. I think that is the number one attribute you have to have with Firaxis, patience.
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However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.
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July 21, 2001, 00:16
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#98
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Born Again Optimist
Local Time: 07:29
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I believe that less than 10% of Firaxis' possible customers are here at Apolyton, which means that Firaxis doesn't need to go to great lenghts to make people here happy.
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I never tend to think of 'making people happy' just a matter of stroking the egos of 10% of your potential customers. Rather, making your customers happy before any potential release is ALWAYS good practice, regardless of any figure. Even if you say, "Well, Apolyton only represents 1% of the potential Civ crowd," you should also consider that they are a very vocal 1%. And anyway, we aren't talking doing any more than giving the public common courtesy. I doubt many people here are asking for a special Apolyton page on the Civ 3 site or anything.
So the issue is more like, "If they can ignore their most avid fans, they can ignore anybody."
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I've been on these boards for a long time and I still don't know what to think when it comes to you -- FrantzX, December 21, 2001
"Yin": Your friendly, neighborhood negative cosmic force.
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July 21, 2001, 00:28
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#99
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King
Local Time: 06:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Hope College
Posts: 2,232
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Originally posted by TechWins
If there are 90,000 visitors for this site, then how many of those visitors are for the civ3 portion of the site?
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What I am saying is that the site is for Civ, so all visitors no matter which page they visit are likely to buy Civ III or at the very least give it a look. They are civ fans and will definitely look at the next generation, it does not matter if they visit civ3.
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If 90,000 of them do look at the civ3 portion than there are about 15% of Firaxis possibly soon to be customers here. If that is the case Firaxis should be giving us great treatment here.
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Let's hope that 90,000 does not represent 15% of those that are going to buy Civ III. That comes out to about 600,000 copies of Civ III sold. While this is not that bad of a number it would be less than Civ I or II, and even, I believe, CTP I. If Civ III sells that many copies it is going to be because the reviews for it will be bad. And bad reviews come because a game is bad, so I hope that this site is not much above 5% of those that end up purchasing the game.
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Since I doubt all 90,000 care about the civ3 site than less than 15% of Firaxis possibly soon to be customers are here at Apolyton. That's not say that the other visitors won't buy Civ3 it's just right now Firaxis doesn't need to cater for 90,000 (15% possible customers) visitors.
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I don't understand what you are saying here. If you are saying that Firaxis should not cater to those that are actively posting on Apolyton Civ III site but other forums (like OT or SMAC) than I disagree. Ditto for they should not cater to those that are posting. We make up a portion of their customers. The ones taht will be making the mods, scenarios, and help them with bug lists.
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I believe that less than 10% of Firaxis' possible customers are here at Apolyton, which means that Firaxis doesn't need to go to great lenghts to make people here happy. I hope you understand what I mean now.
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I agree they do not have to go to great lengths, but how 'bout a thing on their site saying something/anything? They owe us at least a sentence about a game for the first time in two months. They can do that for us, at least I hope they can.
I guess I am holding out hope that the reason for the silence is the poor e3 reviews. They decided to go back and revamp the graphics and release the game in the spring. Not likely but well...
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July 21, 2001, 03:50
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#100
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King
Local Time: 04:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,747
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I never tend to think of 'making people happy' just a matter of stroking the egos of 10% of your potential customers. Rather, making your customers happy before any potential release is ALWAYS good practice, regardless of any figure. Even if you say, "Well, Apolyton only represents 1% of the potential Civ crowd," you should also consider that they are a very vocal 1%. And anyway, we aren't talking doing any more than giving the public common courtesy. I doubt many people here are asking for a special Apolyton page on the Civ 3 site or anything.
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What I'm trying to say is that Firaxis doesn't need to do anything special to make us happy. Simply just a little information here and there (more than what we're currently getting). They shouldn't/won't try to do anything to make us happy.
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What I am saying is that the site is for Civ, so all visitors no matter which page they visit are likely to buy Civ III or at the very least give it a look. They are civ fans and will definitely look at the next generation, it does not matter if they visit civ3.
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I don't understand what you are saying here. If you are saying that Firaxis should not cater to those that are actively posting on Apolyton Civ III site but other forums (like OT or SMAC) than I disagree. Ditto for they should not cater to those that are posting. We make up a portion of their customers. The ones taht will be making the mods, scenarios, and help them with bug lists.
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Yes, there is a great possibility that all 90,000 might very well buy Civ3 but Firaxis doesn't need to apply all their effort to all 90,000. Only the ones who are actually paying great attention to Civ3. They just need to give us a little bit of information to keep us content (still willing to buy the game) not making us drool out of our mouths (giving us great amounts of info). I didn't really help explain how I truely feel very well about all of the hoopla with Firaxis (not Civ3) right now. This next thing might clear some things up.
Right now it seems as if maybe Firaxis is trying so hard (making that new site) that they might be overlooking the people that truely care about Civ3 right now. The site should be done (the other site wasn't very good) but in doing this they should still provide is with some info. much No matter how busy they are, they still have the time to answer one simple question in the Civ3 forum. I feel that the site they are creating is to lure more fans into the Civ3 craze. I'm all for that because they have to do what they have to but what about the old loyal fans. Something like Yin stated ""If they can ignore their most avid fans, they can ignore anybody." I do believe this to a certain extent that they can ignore us but I don't think they will abandon the majority of customers (non-Apolyton Civ3ers). The site and lack of updates seems as a step for them to rid of us and bring the majority of customers with there new site. It may not make much sense but I feel that it is true. It's kind of like how a sports star turns against his/her loyal fans and takes the money to go to a bigger city. Right now Firaxis is taking the money (the site) and leaving there very loyal fans behind (us). I'm not saying that the other customers aren't loyal fans it's just that people here are obviously die hards. I hope nobody gets the wrong impression by this. Civ3 may or may not be a good game, who knows? On the way to making that game the very loyal fans need to be kept content, they don't need to be kept jumping up and down for joy but just content. Most of the very loyal fans are ragging maniacs towards Firaxis now. They might just lose a lot of there very loyal fans if they continue to cater to all of Civ3 possible customers just the very loyal fans. The loyal fans (not the very loyal fans also known as us) are less likely to be looking at the new Civ3 site than the very loyal fans. Meaning that the whole site will not be put to good use and should have stayed on the backburner (get around to it when I have the time list) and given some time to cook slowly (finish the site bits and pieces not all at once). So the very loyal fans would have a had a greater chance of staying happy over the this period of time. Just imagine the past two months with info. Everybody would have that fuzzy feeling in their stomach about Civ3. Instead a lot of people now have a bitter hatred towards Firaxis. I would like to say one more thing, bravo Firaxis, you have now upset your very loyal fans to overall maybe make more people happy, when the other people could care less about Civ3 info right now, it's only the very loyal fans that truely care right now.
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However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.
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July 21, 2001, 10:02
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#101
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:29
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Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Antwerp, Colon's Chocolate Canard Country
Posts: 6,511
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Markos, thanks for the answers but I still have two questions. Firstly are those unique visitors recognised by their IP address or a cookie? (pure curiosity)
And secondly, Firaxis members released interesting details about civ3 (not sure about other civ games), ever seen those being cited or used in games media? (but maybe I should direct this to Imran)
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DISCLAIMER: the author of the above written texts does not warrant or assume any legal liability or responsibility for any offence and insult; disrespect, arrogance and related forms of demeaning behaviour; discrimination based on race, gender, age, income class, body mass, living area, political voting-record, football fan-ship and musical preference; insensitivity towards material, emotional or spiritual distress; and attempted emotional or financial black-mailing, skirt-chasing or death-threats perceived by the reader of the said written texts.
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July 21, 2001, 12:32
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#102
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Apolyton CS Co-Founder
Local Time: 13:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Macedonia, Greece
Posts: 24,480
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Colon
Markos, thanks for the answers but I still have two questions. Firstly are those unique visitors recognised by their IP address or a cookie? (pure curiosity)
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IP, i think
there must be some calculations involved for people who are behind prices....
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And secondly, Firaxis members released interesting details about civ3 (not sure about other civ games), ever seen those being cited or used in games media? (but maybe I should direct this to Imran)
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we have been sited here and there on internet sites about various news we have posted(not just about civ3). our "big moment" was when Sid send his "note to civers" after Brian and co left Firaxis(click here to see the irony of geting mentioned by CGO and having your site's name mispelled  ) ....
Last edited by MarkG; July 21, 2001 at 12:38.
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July 21, 2001, 15:04
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#103
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:29
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Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Antwerp, Colon's Chocolate Canard Country
Posts: 6,511
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Irony? I suppose you meant agony? 
Well, in that case, news released at poly seems to serve an audience beyond its visitors which makes it more worthwhile for Firaxis guys to spend their time on.
” IP, i think
there must be some calculations involved for people who are behind prices....”
Not sure what you meant with that last sentence, aren’t they simply counting the number of IP addresses visiting a site?
__________________
DISCLAIMER: the author of the above written texts does not warrant or assume any legal liability or responsibility for any offence and insult; disrespect, arrogance and related forms of demeaning behaviour; discrimination based on race, gender, age, income class, body mass, living area, political voting-record, football fan-ship and musical preference; insensitivity towards material, emotional or spiritual distress; and attempted emotional or financial black-mailing, skirt-chasing or death-threats perceived by the reader of the said written texts.
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July 21, 2001, 20:02
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#104
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King
Local Time: 06:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Hope College
Posts: 2,232
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Originally posted by Colon
” IP, i think
there must be some calculations involved for people who are behind prices....”
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Pretty sure he meant proxy.
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July 23, 2001, 04:10
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#105
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King
Local Time: 13:29
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: appendix of Europe
Posts: 1,634
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correction
How do I delete 'Dear' from the topic title?
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