August 9, 2001, 20:40
|
#1
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wichita
Posts: 1,352
|
Leaders of the 16 civs in Civ 3, just the facts sir
With the launch of Civ3.com and the announcement of the 16 civs we can now try to accumulate all available information on the issue of who the leaders of these 16 civs are. I am going on the assumption that there is but 1 leader for each Civ, as the Civ of the week article would lead me to believe. (Hammurabi is the lone Babylonian leader mentioned)
Now, let us see here.....
The Americans- Abe Lincoln 100%(Old magazine screenshots)
The Aztecs Montezuma 100% ( http://www.civ3.com/previewwin.cfm?m...800&height=600)
The Babylonians Hammurabi 100% (civ of week section at civ3.com)
The Chinese Mao Zedong? illegible ( http://www.civ3.com/images/headfeatures.gif)
The Egyptians Cleopatra 75%( http://www.civ3.com/previewwin.cfm?m...800&height=600) Note, this leader is only 75% because the picture looks NOTHING like Cleopatra? Perhaps a designer renamed a Ramsses or someone of the like?
The English Elizabeth I 100% ( http://www.civ3.com/previewwin.cfm?m...800&height=600)
The French Joan of Arc 100% ( http://www.civ3.com/images/headfeatures.gif)
The Germans illegible...Hidenburg maybe?
( http://www.civ3.com/images/headfeatures.gif)
The Greeks Alexander the Great 100% (Old magazine screenshots)
The Indians Ghandi 100% (Old magazine screenshots)
The Iroquois unknown
The Japanese unknown, Tokugawa? ( http://apolyton.net/forums/attachmen...&postid=392605)
The Persians Unknown
The Romans Julius Caesar 100% (old magazine screenshots)
The Russians Catherine the Great? Unknown( http://www.civ3.com/images/headfeatu...tid=404268</a>)
The Zulus unknown
Note, at the following link http://www.civ3.com/previewwin.cfm?m...800&height=600
a leader by the name of Brother Bluto appears, can anyone fill me on on what civilization this man is from? Persia I'm guessing, but if anyone can clarify it would be great. (Edit: It turns out the name bluto was pun of sorts by some of the Firaxis staff)
Last edited by monkspider; August 9, 2001 at 21:00.
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 20:41
|
#2
|
|
Emperor
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The Glorious Land of Canada
Posts: 3,234
|
The Chinese leader is obviously Mao, unless "Mao's clone" counts. 
__________________
*grumbles about work*
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 20:42
|
#3
|
|
Firaxis Games
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: The Metropolis known as Hunt Valley
Posts: 612
|
Re: Leaders of the 16 civs in Civ 3, just the facts sir
|
Quote:
|
Originally posted by monkspider
Note, at the following link http://www.civ3.com/previewwin.cfm?m...800&height=600
a leader by the name of Brother Bluto appears, can anyone fill me on on what civilization this man is from? Persia I'm guessing, but if anyone can clarify it would be great.
|
Just testing the custom civ name functionality out there... fans of classic American comedy films should immediately pick up on the joke...
Dan
__________________
Dan Magaha
Firaxis Games, Inc.
--------------------------
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 20:51
|
#4
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wichita
Posts: 1,352
|
LOL thanks for the reply Dan, here I was thinking you were using some obsecure, villianous leader that obviously proved the inspiration for Popeye's notorious villain! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 20:52
|
#5
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wichita
Posts: 1,352
|
Can anyone else confirm that it is, indeed Mao? And if so, Mao Tse Tung or Mao Zedong?
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 20:55
|
#6
|
|
Settler
Local Time: 14:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 65,535
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally posted by monkspider
Can anyone else confirm that it is, indeed Mao? And if so, Mao Tse Tung or Mao Zedong?
|
Spirited debate during our marathon quest leaned us towards Mao Zedong 
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 20:58
|
#7
|
|
King
Local Time: 05:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,747
|
I believe Mao Tse Tung and Mao Zedong is the same person. It's just his name is spelled a different way. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
__________________
However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:00
|
#8
|
|
Settler
Local Time: 14:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 65,535
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally posted by TechWins
I believe Mao Tse Tung and Mao Zedong is the same person. It's just his name is spelled a different way. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
|
You are correct. The spirited debate was about the correct spelling of his name His identity was decided early on.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:03
|
#9
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wichita
Posts: 1,352
|
We are now left with an interesting conjecture, can anyone here identify the man HERE ( http://www.civ3.com/images/screenshots/foreign.jpg) who is indentified as "Brother Bluto"?
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:12
|
#11
|
|
Apolyton CS Co-Founder
Local Time: 14:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Macedonia, Greece
Posts: 24,480
|
it's a test of the custom name feature
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:14
|
#12
|
|
Warlord
Local Time: 04:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 134
|
Re: Re: Leaders of the 16 civs in Civ 3, just the facts sir
|
Quote:
|
Originally posted by Dan Magaha FIRAXIS
Just testing the custom civ name functionality out there... fans of classic American comedy films should immediately pick up on the joke...
Dan
|
TOGA! TOGA!
__________________
"When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk." -Tuco Benedicto Juan Ramirez
"I hate my hat, I hate my clubs, I hate my life" -Marcia
"I think it would be a good idea."
- Mahatma Ghandi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:21
|
#13
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wichita
Posts: 1,352
|
Mark,
I was trying to ask if anyone could identify who the picture of the man is, who is called "brother bluto" in that picture. Sorry for being unclear
As far as i know, it is a picture we have never seen before. The only country i can reasonably see it being, by process of elimination, is someone from Persia.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:24
|
#14
|
|
Firaxis Games
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: The Metropolis known as Hunt Valley
Posts: 612
|
Re: Re: Re: Leaders of the 16 civs in Civ 3, just the facts sir
|
Quote:
|
Originally posted by Warm Beer
TOGA! TOGA!
|
Ding ding ding... someone give Warm Beer a cookie!
Dan
__________________
Dan Magaha
Firaxis Games, Inc.
--------------------------
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 21:25
|
#15
|
|
Apolyton CS Co-Founder
Local Time: 14:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Macedonia, Greece
Posts: 24,480
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally posted by monkspider
Mark,
I was trying to ask if anyone could identify who the picture of the man is, who is called "brother bluto" in that picture. Sorry for being unclear
|
oh, i suppose it's the default picture of Julius Caesar
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 22:00
|
#16
|
|
Warlord
Local Time: 04:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 134
|
Mmmmm, cookies N beer.
It seems there are two pictures of "brother bluto..." on the Civ selection screen and on the diplo screen:
one we can assume is Caesar:
http://www.civ3.com/images/screenshots/playersetup.jpg
But who is this guy?...
http://www.civ3.com/images/screenshots/foreign.jpg
The Start Up screen makes me wonder if civs are tied to color (ala civ II) after all. The screen makes it seem like the Custom "delta house" civ, modeled after the Romans and the Egyptian civilzation can co-exist. The question remains, is it possible for say, Japan and France to be in the same game. At least in a single player game.
__________________
"When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk." -Tuco Benedicto Juan Ramirez
"I hate my hat, I hate my clubs, I hate my life" -Marcia
"I think it would be a good idea."
- Mahatma Ghandi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 9, 2001, 22:42
|
#17
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Wichita
Posts: 1,352
|
exactly my point beer, this guy *MUST* be from Persia, but who is he??
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 02:27
|
#18
|
|
King
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Hope College
Posts: 2,232
|
What is up with the pictures of Cleopotra? My history might be a little off but wasn't she at least part European?
Isn't the skin a little dark for Cleopatra or is just that all movies and pictures in the states are of Eurocentric views of civilization?
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 03:27
|
#19
|
|
Warlord
Local Time: 04:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 134
|
Tniem: I agree with you as far as the whole Cleopatra thing....she was Greek by descendency (is that even a word?!?!) oh wait, ancestry.
Monkspider: perhaps this is caesar from another age (must admit when I first saw him I thought, "Venice?!?!") Another fellow brought up that it appears that leaders' images changes with the times...
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...712#post413712
That's the "Just the facts ma'am" thread...Alexander01 made the observation.
__________________
"When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk." -Tuco Benedicto Juan Ramirez
"I hate my hat, I hate my clubs, I hate my life" -Marcia
"I think it would be a good idea."
- Mahatma Ghandi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 04:24
|
#20
|
|
Deity
Local Time: 20:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
|
The Cleopatra thing is open to debate. How could she rule Egypt if she's not from a royal line? That makes her African.
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 04:47
|
#21
|
|
Warlord
Local Time: 04:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 134
|
When Alexander the Great conquered Egypt (among other lands) he died with out an heir. Hence his kingdom was divided between three generals, among whom was Ptolemy- he got Eqypt. Cleopatra is a decenant of Ptolemy. Her royal line is derived from the Macedonian conqueror.
very brief explanation...
[edit-misspelled Egypt... too many cold beers, methinks]
__________________
"When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk." -Tuco Benedicto Juan Ramirez
"I hate my hat, I hate my clubs, I hate my life" -Marcia
"I think it would be a good idea."
- Mahatma Ghandi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization
Last edited by Warm Beer; August 10, 2001 at 04:54.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 04:47
|
#22
|
|
Apolyton CS Co-Founder
Local Time: 14:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Macedonia, Greece
Posts: 24,480
|
edited: what WB said
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 05:05
|
#23
|
|
Emperor
Local Time: 12:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Khoon Ki Pyasi Dayan (1988)
Posts: 3,951
|
As an artistic interpretation, it's not completely improbable. There is a certain amount of evidence that she was at least 1/4 black. If you notice the woman pictured has clear caucasian features- note the nose, for instance. Plus, it's sunny in North Africa. The combination of 1/4 african descent, dark mediterranean features and a hefty spot at the beach each day could certainly produce an effect like this.
Plus, she's been considered Black or Mulatto in popular lore (which, after all, is what counts) at least since Shakespeare.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 07:31
|
#24
|
|
Prince
Local Time: 20:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 888
|
Now... Waaaiit a minute.
Why do you assume that the guy labelled Brother Bluto is the image for the male Persian? Could be Russian male. If it is Persian, then my bet would be Xerxes, but that ain't no fact.
As for German leader, looks like they have it being Bismarck von Otto (should be Otto von Bismarck)
__________________
Golfing since 67
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 07:33
|
#25
|
|
Emperor
Local Time: 12:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Khoon Ki Pyasi Dayan (1988)
Posts: 3,951
|
Er, that's exactly the same guy as in the other Caesar pic. Except he is in his "renaissance" appearance. See separate thread.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 15:52
|
#26
|
|
Settler
Local Time: 07:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 14
|
DITCH MAO!
They don't have Stalin representing the Russians, nor Hitler representing the Germans. This is my one peeve for the game. If there's no way to change the Mao animated leader, I'll delete the Chinese from the game. And that's actually my favorite civ.
B
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 16:07
|
#27
|
|
Deity
Local Time: 08:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: 138% of your RDA of Irony
Posts: 18,577
|
|
Quote:
|
|
Monkspider: perhaps this is caesar from another age (must admit when I first saw him I thought, "Venice?!?!") Another fellow brought up that it appears that leaders' images changes with the times...
|
I agree. The garb reminded me of Renaissance Italy a great deal, and the two faces look the same (try a side-by-side comparison).
In addition, they both have the same name, and one with "classical" connotations at that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 10, 2001, 22:42
|
#28
|
Local Time: 06:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Resident Mormon
Posts: 2,853
|
Xerxes would not look like "Brother Bluto." Persians (at least Achaemenid Persians [Cyrus, Darius, Xerxes, etc.] are portrayed on their monuments with mustaches and square like beards. The crown is similiar in shape to Hammurabi's but white, with vertical, triangular obtrusions on the sides instead of the rounded horizontal ones on Babylon's crown.
Iroquois leader = Hiawatha 100% (saw it in an article)
Japanese leader = Tokugawa Ieyasu 95% (see civs included thread for details and arguments for this conclusion)
Egyptians are almost definitely Cleopatra. Sorry. Yes, she probably was a mixed breed. The original Greek blood went back something like 20 generations. Some of those Ptolemies married native noblewomen, priestesses and princesses to solidify their shaky foreigner position by assimilating themselves into the Egyptian culture (and genepool )
Zulus are almost undoubtedly Shaka.
Every civ has had their CivII counterpart so far. It also looks as though they are trying to do away with the ficticious characters (Hippolyta, Ishtari, Amaterasu, Shakala, etc.)
While the German pic appears to say "Bismarck von Otto," I believe this is a renaming joke, and the leader is Frederick. Barbarossa this time, not kooky Frederick II like CivII. Besides, CTP used Bismarck, and using it in CivIII would be copying. (Like CTP did to CivII), and Firaxis wouldn't sink to...sigh...Activision's level.
Any further thoughts? What about UUs and special abilities?
__________________
The Apolytoner formerly known as Alexander01
"God has given no greater spur to victory than contempt of death." - Hannibal Barca, c. 218 B.C.
"We can legislate until doomsday but that will not make men righteous." - George Albert Smith, A.D. 1949
The Kingdom of Jerusalem: Chronicles of the Golden Cross - a Crusader Kings After Action Report
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 11, 2001, 00:28
|
#29
|
Local Time: 06:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Resident Mormon
Posts: 2,853
|
Here are some images of Persian kings that I dug up. I suppose we can expect the animation to look like these if they don't try to model them after some Arab kook.
Darius (white crown and dark brown beard)
Xerxes (gold crown and purple beard [don;t ask me why -- the coloring of the picture is a little weird])
Darius is in council with is advisors, Xerxes is communing with his prime minister, the infamous Haman. Both Kings are the individuals on the right of the pictures.
***********************
Alas, I don't have as much computer savvy as I would like, so I was only able to post Darius in this message. I shall put on Xerxes in a moment.
__________________
The Apolytoner formerly known as Alexander01
"God has given no greater spur to victory than contempt of death." - Hannibal Barca, c. 218 B.C.
"We can legislate until doomsday but that will not make men righteous." - George Albert Smith, A.D. 1949
The Kingdom of Jerusalem: Chronicles of the Golden Cross - a Crusader Kings After Action Report
|
|
|
|
|
|
August 11, 2001, 00:32
|
#30
|
Local Time: 06:25
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Resident Mormon
Posts: 2,853
|
Here is Xerxes.
__________________
The Apolytoner formerly known as Alexander01
"God has given no greater spur to victory than contempt of death." - Hannibal Barca, c. 218 B.C.
"We can legislate until doomsday but that will not make men righteous." - George Albert Smith, A.D. 1949
The Kingdom of Jerusalem: Chronicles of the Golden Cross - a Crusader Kings After Action Report
|
|
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is On
|
|
|
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:25.
|
|
