Sea battles

miloII · November 5, 2001, 09:31

why do I lose almost every battle against computer opponents, even my ironclads against Carvels lose 95% of the time; I have lost Man od War's against Caravels

Is there something wtong in the game, or am I missing somethins, or is it just pointless to try to attack a ship from another civ?

MaSsConFUsi0n · November 5, 2001, 09:35

i just think that the game favors the ai, that's all. i've lost to many warriers on open terrain when i attack with ELITE riders!!! 4 attack vs 1 defend should give me a little better results, but i lose all the time. then the ai attacks my fortified pikeman in a size 12 city with some loser swordsman and takes my elite pikey down to ONE hp!!! very irritating.

MaSsConFUsi0n

Gaius Marius · November 5, 2001, 22:29

Are we playing the same game?

albiedamned · November 5, 2001, 22:57

It has been confirmed on these message boards by Soren Johnson, who programmed the AI, that there is no AI combat bonus. The AI does cheat on higher levels in terms of production, but not in combat.

Sullustan · November 5, 2001, 22:58

A 12 city with pikeman in it? I think you need to throw something else in that sucker.

vovan · November 5, 2001, 23:15

Seems like some mass confusion!

Seriously, though, never happened to me. Attacking other ships is just fine. Naval warfare is just great.

miloII, MaSsConFUsi0n, have you been using the editor a lot?

miloII · November 6, 2001, 00:32

no I have never tried using the editor....

duxup · November 6, 2001, 08:24

I went through a streak where my Ironclad won a large number of their battles, actually pounding the enemy easily. Then suddenly, bamn, they all started loosing, and fast. They were against different enemies this time, but all with the same experience as the those I'd pounded. Very odd.

Many of the losses came in enemy territory waters, is there an advantage in such waters?

MaSsConFUsi0n · November 6, 2001, 19:04

no, i haven't used the editor at all

and the city was size 12 cause it was i my cities grow too fast

MaSsConFUsi0n

Monoriu · November 6, 2001, 21:32

I initially also thought that the AI has a combat bonus, but I was forced to change my opinion after what I saw last night.

I had an elite ironclad with 3 strength alone. 5, yes 5 AI frigates attacked it. It sank all 5 of them and survived with 1 strength left. I was playing on Regent level.

The combat results can be quite extreme. Another thing is, I think we all remember our unlucky times more than we remember it when we are lucky

shammy · November 7, 2001, 19:05

my frustrating experiences:
lost two of my elite submarines.. to.. a.. trireme
lost my battleship.. to.. a.. caravel
lost my panzer tanks (3) to HOPLITE defending the city
two other panzer tanks got mowed down by knights

if i have supreme tech.. why cant i be totally supreme on the battlefield against medieval or ANCIENT crap. sigh. if firaxis wont change this, it would be nice to give us an option to choose more realistic combat..

jakedw · November 7, 2001, 19:40

Quote:

Originally posted by shammy
my frustrating experiences:
lost two of my elite submarines.. to.. a.. trireme
lost my battleship.. to.. a.. caravel
lost my panzer tanks (3) to HOPLITE defending the city
two other panzer tanks got mowed down by knights

if i have supreme tech.. why cant i be totally supreme on the battlefield against medieval or ANCIENT crap. sigh. if firaxis wont change this, it would be nice to give us an option to choose more realistic combat..

They have given you an option: use the editor

Jake

Kissinger · November 7, 2001, 19:56

Yeah Same thing happened to me. I was playing an island game so I had a huge navy. Playing on warlord since I never played any of the other civs, yes im a newb

. Anyhow, I had about 7 ironclads and I lost 3 of them to 3 caravels. Seems a little odd since if you were to shoot a cannon like the ones that would be on a caravel it would simply bounce off the ironclad, as we saw in the famous civil war naval battle.

notyoueither · November 7, 2001, 19:57

Nope, don't see a cheat for AI in combat. Have not had much experience in modern combat yet (unfortunately, life intrudes on Civ far too much) BUT...

Cleaned out the Greek civ with Elite Legions winning 2 out of 3 combats against Regular Hoplites fortified in cities. I wonder if all the AIs have their own message board where they wonder about how the humans do it.

Brought in catapults to soften up Athens though, and didn't attack until a round in which all of the defenders had taken at least 1 hit.

Have won far too many battles to count with warriors against barbarians. Had a Regular Spearman (fortified in small city) successfully fend off 8 barbarian horsemen.

Most recently, had an Elite Legion loose when attacking a regular warrior in forest.

Ah well, can't all go my way.

My experiences have led me to be far less adverse to war than many people might be. Have won 2 out of 2 ancient wars that saw the good guys (that's me with the Imperial Eagles) all but obliterate my closest competeing civ (they had 9 or 12 cities to begin with). I might have to coclude that the designers got it right, have Legions, will travel.

Monoriu · November 7, 2001, 21:30

I am currently playing on Regent level and is simultaneously fighting 7 AI civs, so I fight a lot of naval battles. I am currently using destroyers and ironclads against mainly frigates and man-o-wars. Every ship that the AI throws at me is sunk and I seldom lose a ship.

For all those who are saying you are losing subs, battleships against mid ages ships, I am wondering about two things:

1. Do you always, I mean every single time, soften up the enemy ships first by bombardment? I always do. I only melee attack a ship if and only if it is not at full strength.

2. Do you always, I mean every single time, melee attack only with a full strength unit? I always do. Non-sull strength units are used to bombard or should heal.

Andrew_Jay · November 7, 2001, 22:29

An elite Legion attacking regualr warriors in the forest? Sounds like the opening scene of Gladiator

Except the Romans won . . .

splangy · November 7, 2001, 22:49

My combat is fine. Ive won every battle I deserved to win (except 1 or 2, but thats what makes the game fun!) and lost every one I deserved to lose (Except that warrior vs swordsman on open ground, but you dont see me complaining

)

dopplex · November 7, 2001, 22:58

Perhaps there could be some sort of deficiency with the random number generator being used for things such as combat. It often seems a little bit too "streaky" to me. ex. My infantry will fight off 7 or 8 attacking jaguar warriors (backwards Aztecs...) taking maybe one damage point, and then another infantry unit will be killed while attacking a single normal warrior unit..

Also, is anyone else noticing that elite units seem to have a combat advantage in addition to their hit points? It's been seemign that way to me for some time now.

ndnls · November 8, 2001, 00:38

sigh...

Civ 2 worked so hard to remove "Phalanx Destroys Bomber"
situations and Civ 3 goes and puts them right back in.

Firepower and Hit-points would definitely moderate those
"extreme" combat results instead of having units killing and dying
in such arbitrary ways.

Oops! Almost forgot; try bombardment. A horde of artillery with
some fast movers in front to clear a path, defend your guns and
take cities is really powerful! Reduces even the most heavily
defended cities to rubble so you can just mop up.