Vote on the specific of our war plan

[MrWhereItsAt]

Now that it seems like almost a foregone conclusion that the Superclads shall be chosen as our path to victory over the bourgeois capitalist corrupt Republican swine that are the rulers of Egypt and America's fine workers , and that we are to crush the leaders of both nations beneath the collective marching feet of the Apolytonian Workers, we must decide where to strike first!


Egypt

There are 5 cities in Egypt, and we have located three - Thebes (capital), Alexandria and Memphis. The fall of Thebes probably means disorder in their cities and all we need do is roll in some diplomats and bribe their corrupt officials into fleeing into exile. Furthermore, the Wonders Marco Polo's Embassy and he Pyramids would fall into our hands! Thus I propose Thebes be
our first Egyptian target. The other two cities are deeper into enemy territory and will require some careful approaches.

America

Philadelphia is one of the three (according to Head of our International Communist Bureau Hydey) American cities. The other we have located is Washington - the capital, which has Shakespeare's Theatre. The unlocated New York (see my map for where I suspect the city is) has the Great Library. Although Philadelphia is the least tempting target for our righteous fury, it is the closest to us and thus my recommended first American target.

I propose this: My feeling is that we wait for a minimum of 5 'Clads, and we split them 3/2 and attack Philadelphia and Thebes at once. Philadelphia is two turns away from our Crusader stationed two squares NE of Heliopolis. Once we have eliminated the defenders in Philadelphia, we can move the Crusaders (and Musketeer that is on the same square) to the Tundra square two squares SW of Philadelphia (red arrow), and enter the city the next turn. Any defenders built in the city in the intervening turn can be eliminated by the Superclads prior to entering the city.

Thebes' terrain is trickier, plus it is further away. 6 Crusaders are inside Heliopolis, and I believe two of these should be moved to the forest square indicated in my map. The Crusader SE of Heliopolis should be moved to the tundra square on my map (green arrow), where it can act as a backup in case of tragedy, and as a forward defence to any units moving from the East. They must be supported by at least one Musketeer - and there are two available (with a caravel) quite far N of here, E of kIndalia. If we bring these two down and position them with the Crusaders, this should provide adequate defense for once we have Thebes. However, we should not move these units into place until our Superclads have reached the coast near Thebes, and can target any units leaving the city. Then we move the Crusaders/Musketeers down whilst our 'Clads are bombing the hats off of Egypt's fat cat rulers. Once Thebes is undefended, one Crusader can move (in two turns) to take Thebes.

So, the above poll is multi-option: first whether to attack two cities or one; to attack when all our troops are in place or when one city attack squad is completely ready; and which city(ies) to attack FIRST. Note that I strongly recommend we don't attack more than two cities at the moment.

One last thing - how quickly should this start? We have 6 'Clads in production, and with rushing we can have 5 in place for less than 700 gold (if we rush NOW) in about 6 turns. We can wait 2-3 turns and this rush cost drops to probably 300 or so (we have 2130 gold and our income is +60/turn).

Post your thoughts, please!

Minister of WAR, not peace.
MrWIA.

[MrWhereItsAt]

Hopefully all clear enough... Let me know if you want more.

[Space05us]

well i say attack thebes first. wait a couple of more turns before rushing the 'clads, 700 gold is a wee bit expensive this early in the game.

[Hydey]

Incremental rushbuy the clads and strike ASAP

[Bear]

I assume that you think New York is in that black square 3 spaces south of Washington?

[civman2000]

...only a third of the people vote for one of the one city/ two cities options, and only half for one of the "when to attack options".

I support rushbuying, we've got plenty of gold and are getting it quickly, this is worth our money!

[MrWhereItsAt]

Er, yes BEar, I do think that. Sorry.

I'm actually surprised more ppl haven't complained about the confusing nature of my post.

Minister of WAR, not peace.
MrWIA.

[Kropotkin]

If we attack the american, or even if we don't, it might be a neat idea to land a small force at the base of the Washington peninsula and take the fortress. That way we could cut of the country in half and stop reinforcements moving between the two parts of the american (poor excuse of a) empire. The same applies to egyptian forces looking for a fight. At the same time, and this might be even better; it could be a base for futher conquests.

[MrWhereItsAt]

You have a point there, Kropotkin. Fortresses provide a 100% bonus to defense. But then fortifying on one of the surrounding hills gives us +100% terrain, +50% fortify. Then again, having units in the fortress, and thus on roads, makes 2/3 one move extra for us, and means we lose only one unit at a time (not that we would lose units, of course! We would in either case need a minimum of one extra musketeer than in my above plan, better two.

Questions, comments?

Even so much as a yes or no to this idea of Kropotkin's would help.

Minister of WAR, not peace.
MrWIA.

[H Tower]

i don't believe that we actually need to land troops there in that fortress. it shoud be relatively easy to pick off any counterattacks the AI throws at us. We could just advance to that point over land after taking philly and thebes

[Kuciwalker]

I say we take the fortress, but leave one Musketeer and Crusader on the Hill, so that we can hit Memphis from there in one turn instead of two.

Instead of the square marked by the green arrow, we should move one Musketeer and Crusader (I like this combination for obvious reasons) on the Forest two north of Thebes, so that we can hit Thebes the same turn that we kill all of the defenders. We should have one Crusader just south of the Whale Lake as backup.

Instead of the Tundra square near Philadelphia, we should move one Crusader and Musketeer to the Hill two square southeast of Philadelphia. This not only gives us a better defense from the Hill's defense bonus, we can detect any westward thrusts from Memphis, as well as securing a route to Memphis if we decide to bypass Philadelphia.

Instead of more Crusaders, of which we have plenty, we should be moving in more Musketeers, to escort our smaller Crusader groups. This would slow them down, but greatly decrease their risk of destruction while they move through hostile territory. I say we have plenty of Crusaders because I'm assuming that we'll be bribing Memphis and New York, as they are the only inland cities (at least if New York is where we think it is).

Finally, I say that we rush the Ironclads (incrementally, of course) because our conquest seems to be behind schedule and every turn counts. If we're going to win a conquest victory, we need to step up the pace of our conquests, because it will likely be more difficult to attack the other power.

[cavebear]

I favor taking Philadelphia first. One, its closer. Two, it's quicker. Three, attacking an American city should start to bleed American troops out of their other cities, and we should have no trouble picking them off as they near Philadelphia of Apolyton.

Thebes has been loosing Catapaults against Heliopolis. I think the Ironclad being build there (Helio) might just wipe out all the units, one per turn. We just keep hitting it until the flag goes down. If the flag stays flying, we bring the 2nd Ironclad to bear. Thebes is rather out of the way otherwise.

[Kuciwalker]

If we take Thebes, we can bribe Memphis a LOT more easily, and Memphis is very important strategically, as it can control movement throught the continent.

[atawa]

Buy 2 clads if we have the money, first attack Thebes, station some musketeers and a few crusaders there.
We can then just bribe the remaining Egyptian city's.

After conquering Thebes, sail the 2 clads to Philly.

In the meantime the other 3 clads will be ready, send them with 2 musks and a cat on to Washington. This will be enough to take and keep the city. Send another couple of units to

Attack washington and Philly at the same time, leaving the Americans with 1 city in the middle, unable to launch a counterattack

We dont need units on the tundra, just put 2 musks and a crusader on a ship, kill the units in the city with clads, walk the crusader in and sail the caraval with the musks in, giving them the chance to fortify on the same turn.

[Kropotkin]

Do we have any recent reports or indications over the number of units defending those cities? If one nation have a tendency to have fewer units than the other then that could help us decide over our war plans as it would mean more gain from less effort and less units.

[Space05us]

the first truely Democratic poll I've seen so far. wait how are there 16 voters but 43 votes?

[atawa]

Its 3 polls in one.

Some people didnt vote in all 3 though or there would have been 48.

The americans only have 3 city's, they have at least one or two settlers, a ship and 2 attacking units.
There shouldnt be more then 3 defenders in each city, and fighting with clads against phalanx is a joke.

[cavebear]

OK, how about this? Light can buy an Ironclad for 64 gold, and it takes 4 turns to reach Thebes. I can do the buy before 1720 is completed, so it gets there in 4 turns. Heliopolis is building an Ironclad, and it will be close to finished by the time the Light Ironclad arrives, so we rush it cheap.

Meanwhile, a Coal Caravan will reach Thebes in 4 turns anyway. So we establish the trade route, get a couple hundred beakers and gold (more than paying for the Ironclads), and attack Thebes on the next turn. We will have a Crusader and a Musketeer to enter the city on that turn (the Musketeer will be on the Caravel with the Caravan).

While we are doing that. The other Ironclads will be near completion or rushed for only a few hundred gold (by that time) and will head for Philadelphia with Musketeers on the Caravel from Umbra.

The Thebes Ironclads will be on their way to the American Front, and both groups will combine to simply eliminate all defenders in Washington. Then we sail around to find the other Egyptian and American cities.

In just 2 game sessions we will have taken at least 3 cities (2 of them Capitals) and gained Pyramids, Marco Polo's, and Shakespeare's. Our Crusader force will sweep across the land area and knock off any wandering Egyptian/American units. The 2 Caravels in the area will transport Musketeers.

When we know (for sure) where New York is (and since it is the second American city built, it makes sense it is that one miserable spot we can't see from the coast), we will get the GL and catch up on the older techs we missed!

[MrWhereItsAt]

I forgot about the Caravel approaching and the other one just N of the island Thanks for pointing it out there, atawa, Prez cavebear. The Superclad is a new concept to me game-wise, but if so many think that it is that powerful, then so be it. Prez cavebear's plan sounds great. It requires a little shunting of musketeers around with caravels, but I'm sure we don't need to poll on these preparatory movements.

So, unless there are otherwise objections, that shall be The Plan that nets us embassies with all, Granaries in every city (what will that do to our Demographics ), a host of techs, the GL and Shakespeare.

And ppl say we don't have the ppl's best interests at heart.

Minister of WAR, not peace.
MrWIA.

[cavebear]

Do you feel up to diagramming the moves needed for accomplishing the overall combined attack and related moves? Like Sodaq did for our attack on Elephantine? It makes it much easier to avoid missing important moves during the game session.

[Hydey]

Yes Yes what cavebear said will do it nicely

[JCP]

The War ministry's plan is OK, but with some amendments :
1/ I've the same proposal that attawa and cavebear : if we have a caravel near Heliopolis, it may transport one musketeer and one crusader along with ironclads, so we take Thebes in the turn we empty it with clads. (to land crusader on grassland, which enter in the city on the second move, then to bring the caravel in the city and fortify musk indoor)
2/ We need several diplo nearby, for bribing other egyptians cities after the Thebes fall.
Nevertheless there is a risk that the following will not be so easy : as Egypt has several cities, if they have some money, they may move teir capital from Thebes to a remote city That may delay bribing other cities!)

[Hydey]

Originally posted by JCP
as Egypt has several cities, if they have some money, they may move teir capital from Thebes to a remote city That may delay bribing other cities!)

331 gold in treasury of the Egyptians.

[Kuciwalker]

We have the resources to conquer both cities. There's no real reason not to. If we don't do it now, it will be a lot harder later on.

[Zedd]

Sounds like a great plan.
How long after the fall of Washington could we take Philly or NY?

[Gen. Hancock]

I favor attacking Thebes first and then going for Philidelphia, just because it seems like the safer plan of action. After taking Philidelphia I suggest making peace with the Americans and ending this bloody war with them. Also I propose demanding tribute from them for what they did to our caravel.

[MrWhereItsAt]

Originally posted by cavebear
Do you feel up to diagramming the moves needed for accomplishing the overall combined attack and related moves? Like Sodaq did for our attack on Elephantine? It makes it much easier to avoid missing important moves during the game session.

I'll try, Comrade Premier (sorry I keep calling you President ).

What kind of deadline do I have? I will have to post it here for approval first.

Minister of WAR, not peace.
MrWIA.

[cavebear]

Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt

I'll try, Comrade Premier (sorry I keep calling you President ).

I get confused too. I seem to be President of our Democracy Game, but also Premier of our Communist Apolyton Government.

What kind of deadline do I have? I will have to post it here for approval first.

Minister of WAR, not peace.
MrWIA.

I'll be playing the next session Saturday afternoon -5GMT. There are a lot of different ideas about how to proceed with the war effort, and there are the poll results to follow. I think it would be a good idea for the Citizens to see a graphic representation of the recommendation of the Minister of War for the accomplishment of the will of the People.

[Gen. Hancock]

End this frickin War you bloody fools

[Gen. Hancock]

sorry just had to rant and rave a bit