The Korean Civilization II

[Q Classic]

Q, is the demilitarized zone as dangerous as it is considered? We keep a lot of our guys there.

well, yes, in some respects. there are the occasional scattered incidents in which there is a brief bit of gunfire, and it's one of the most heavily mined regions in the world, and you've got several thousand people, ready to fire their weapons at each other on a hair trigger...

After checking my world almanac, it said that North Korea has the 4th largest army in the world. They outnumber the South Koreans 2 to 1, yet they spend less than a half on their military than South Korea.

skorea has the fifth largest, too. the difference between nkorea's and skorea's active duty rosters is at a rather high 500k.
now, as for what you said about spending: nkorea does spend less than half of what skorea does; but you're also missing one critical point--that the proportion of their total budget spent is very very different. nkorea spends close to half, if not more, of their GDP on just the military, while last i check, skorea doesn't even spend 5% of its GDP on defense-- and yet, skorea still manages to outspend nkorea.

Their airforce is bigger, and they have CHINA as an ally! Why won't they attack and destroy South Korea?

their airforce and their army are both bigger than the skorean counterparts. but they are also considerably less well equipped. while skorea has f16s fighterplanes and is developing newer, native aircraft for the military, nkorea is still saddled with ancient planes (from the f4 era and before) with a few token mig29s. so although nkorea outnumbers skorea, skorea definitely has a huge advantage.
now, as for china being an ally-- they're pretty much only allies on paper only. the prc would definitely not want anything to happen to skorea, for the simple reason that skorea, along with japan, the us, and taiwan, are pretty much some of the biggest investors--and any invasion of skorea would immediately put a halt to investment from those four countries, quite possibly crippling the rising chinese economy-- something they want to avoid at all costs.
and that's why, in part, nkorea won't attack; skorea has too big of a technological edge, it has the us backing it, while nkorea doesn't have its troops too well equipped with almost no support for any invasion from china.

Korea (as a whole) should be commercial/militaristic in PtW, since Korea is historically very militaristic (they almost defeated us), but they are a huge economy too. I think that Korea in PtW would represent both North Korea and South Korea equally, so these traits would accurately represent them.

i don't really buy the militaristic side of things, mainly because korea never really tried to go conquering other nations.
i'd much rather have industrious/scientific or commercial/scientific, because the scientific part best represents the nation before the modern era, and commercial or industrious represents how korea has behaved in much of the modern era--nkorea was to be a worker's paradise, and skorea is one of the largest shipbuilders in the world, for instance.

[GhengisFarb™]

I agree with Q Cubed's last post. Definitely think Scientific/Commercial is the best fit for Korea, does anybody remember the huge shipment of cows the US gave to North Korea to help them build up a food base?

Instead of raising them to generate future herds they divided ALL of them up and distributed them to troops on the front. Two weeks later they were starving again.

Don't even ask about the "disappearing" SK families near the North Korean border...........

[King of Rasslin]

[quote]it's adolf.

not adolph.

and...

my vote leans to kim il sung, because without his poison, korea would be one country, semi-democratic, and strong...

but for that matter, i might as well point the finger at truman, tojo, hirohito, mao, stalin, and rhee. [quote]

Q Cubed said this in the OT forum. Kim Il Sung is the "great leader" of Korea today, right? Has he really been around since the 50's? I wouldn't say this guy is worse that Hitler or Stalin. He isn't even mentioned in my history class, but I know you would make comments about it, so...

Why not Mao? I understand that he killed more people than Stalin, Hitler, or Pol Pot. He is also why Asian history isn't taught in our schools. In the cultural revolution, all of the old ways were destroyed and the new ways were set in. If they don't respect their own culture, there is no chance of me learning anything about it over here.

The US has barely had any bad presidents, but why are you accusing Truman of being a bad leader? Is it because he nuked a bunch of fanatical Japanese, ending WWII and saving Korea from becoming sushi? My grandpa said that there was 1 Japanese person that actually surrendered from an island, and a soldier had a knife to his back and told him to give up. He did for a while, but then he strugged to escape and impaled himself on the knife. I wouldn't even think a terrorist would do something like that!

But seriously, Truman was right in his nuking of Japan. The people there would have fought until none of them were left. Who is Rhee?

[Q Classic]

yes, i said it.

and yes, adolf hitler spelled his name with an f, not a ph.

Q Cubed said this in the OT forum. Kim Il Sung is the "great leader" of Korea today, right? Has he really been around since the 50's? I wouldn't say this guy is worse that Hitler or Stalin. He isn't even mentioned in my history class, but I know you would make comments about it, so...

"most evil leader" is a term that cannot be given objectively. the way i see it, without kim il sung, korea would have been unified, and we wouldn't have 10 million nkoreans starving today, eating dirt, grass, and other people just in an attempt to survive because their economy is non-existent. he was in power from 1945 until his death in 1994, at which point his son, the just as evil Kim Jong Il, took power.
as for not being mentioned in your history class, your previous statements make that comment utterly ludicrous-- your history class didn't teach you anything about the real world, KoR, why would you expect it to teach you about Kim Il Sung?

Why not Mao? I understand that he killed more people than Stalin, Hitler, or Pol Pot. He is also why Asian history isn't taught in our schools. In the cultural revolution, all of the old ways were destroyed and the new ways were set in. If they don't respect their own culture, there is no chance of me learning anything about it over here.

Mao didn't destroy Asian history, and he is not the reason why Asian history isn't taught in American schools. the reason why asian history isn't taught is because you Americans don't think asian history is worth putting in your books.
and in case you didn't notice, i said he was evil too...
Mao was a) chinese, and didn't affect korean, japanese, taiwanese, mongolian, thai, viet, or laotian culture, to name a few, with his idiotic cultural revolution. furthermore, the cultural revolution was NOT designed to "destroy all the old ways"--rather, it was designed to eliminate all western capitalist and intellectual thought, while preserving traditional chinese morals and communist thoughts.

The US has barely had any bad presidents, but why are you accusing Truman of being a bad leader? Is it because he nuked a bunch of fanatical Japanese, ending WWII and saving Korea from becoming sushi?

...

But seriously, Truman was right in his nuking of Japan. The people there would have fought until none of them were left. Who is Rhee?

you have no idea what you're talking about, do you? have you read any of my posts regarding the nuclear weapons?
in: Getting history right: Japan, germ warfare and the nuke. i come out in favor of the use of atomics in japan. i quote myself here:

the japanese deserved it, flat out.

this is my position: the atomic bomb was an atrocity. a horrific one. but i feel no sorrow, no pity, not for the japanese people, not while the brutality and the atrocities they visited among the peoples of korea, china, and taiwan, as well as most of the rest of the pacific rim, remained ignored and whitewashed by the world at large.
the japanese killed perhaps up to ten times as many in their forty-year reign of terror in korea, and you expect me to shed a tear for japanese civilians? fat chance.
i hope that atomics are never used again, but for you to want an apology, for you to think that the japanese are victims, while simultaneously being utterly silent about their atrocities, is to let them hoodwink you into believing that their people were innocent and pure in the crimes visited upon everyone in the twentieth century.

in: Remembering Hiroshima i say pretty much the same thing:

do i feel pity for the japanese civilians caught in the blast and the aftermath? yes, i do.
do i think that atomics are a curse bestowed upon an idiotic human race? yes, i do.
do i think truman had a choice? yes, i do.
do i fervently hope that no atmoics will ever be used again? yes, i do.
do i feel that japan deserved them? yes, i do.

i'm not denying that the hiroshima and nagasaki were appalling. all i'm saying is that they don't deserve as much pity and grief as they seem to want.

just click on those two thread links, also on the Off-Topic forums. you'll see your allegations that i think the bombing were wrong-- i'm very much in favor of them.

that said, do you know why i think Truman is evil? it's because he and his idiotic foreign ministers were the ones who decided korea should be divided along the 38th parallel, with the north occupied by the USSR and the south by the USA. it's a load of crock, if he had any guts, he would have insisted that korea be entirely under the US umbrella-- the USSR did jack sh1t in the pacific theatre, and thus, they deserved nothing of japan and nothing of korea.
rhee syngman was the first leader of skorea, a corrupt, third-world leader who did nothing but enrich himself, bankrupt the country even more, and weaken it enough for the communists to try and attack.

KoR, get your facts straight before you say anything.

[King of Rasslin]

Granted, the Russians did most of the fighting in WWII in the east front. They did deserve something in return, but it was strange to give them North Korea. They were content with it being communist, but they kind of lost focus on it. Of all places, they later chose to invade Afghanistan instead! Stupid Russians.

And Korea can never be united because of the pro communists living in the north. A guy that went to North Korea said that the only safe topic was pro wrestling (seriously) because talking politics over there will get you in trouble. And a lot of South Korea's economy is really because of our support, although capitalism does play a part. It would be sad if NKorea went capitalism today, because we wouldn't support them and help them off their feet, since it's obviously more important to attack an Iraqi dictator that's making fun of us.

Russia's democracy and capitalism haven't helped it a bit. It would do more long term harm than good to have North Korea ruined like Russia is today.

By the way, I think you tend to favor the Koreans slightly in arguements, but it might just be a coincidence. I do feel sorry for the Japanese getting nuked, but it was something that had to be done. You compare that to what they did in Korea, so I sense a tone of revenge here. You do feel sorry for them, but there wasn't a better way to defeat them.

By the way, Laos and Vietnam are communist today because of China's influence. I can understand why you see your leaders as very bad, but I really do not hate Truman at all. He didn't have all of the socialist, liberal policies that FDR imposed on us. I also doubt that Euro history is mentioned a lot in China, or Korea for that matter. Christopher Columbus is like a celebrity in the history books today, even "world history."

[King of Rasslin]

I just read some of the stuff on your web site. I'm glad to hear you didn't vote for Cynthia Mckinney, but you are very harsh on people that have a difficult time voting. Since they have voting in Spanish here, it's fair to say that someone that doesn't know any English at all has just as many rights as I do. It is disappointing that some of the illiterates are natural citizens of this country. I like the computer voting system, but I hope the 80 year old guy will know how to use it. I didn't vote at all since I don't know anything about the candidates. But based on what you said, I doubt if anyone else does either! At least I don't have autodialers calling me for now, begging for a vote. I didn't bother to vote against CMK because everyone knew she was history anyway.

And I also saw that you want Japan to apologize to Korea. It would be good for relations, and it would benefit both countries. It just isn't going to happen. If Japan had decided to make ironclad ships, it would be like admitting that Korea had the superior design. Even though Japan lost WWII and its dominance in Korea, they will never apologize because they don't want to admit that they are human too. Looking at some of their anime (DBZ, Pilot Candidate, Gundam) makes me think they are really racist or they think they are the ultimate race, but that's just me.

Another interesting thing. Some Korean history websites talk about the 3 kingdoms period, etc in a very plain way. It's almost like there are no good guys or bad guys in Korea. Over here, we were the good guys in every single war (except the North gets favored in the Civil War chapter ). It's so much easier to learn biased history, don't you think?

[Q Classic]

And Korea can never be united because of the pro communists living in the north. A guy that went to North Korea said that the only safe topic was pro wrestling (seriously) because talking politics over there will get you in trouble. And a lot of South Korea's economy is really because of our support, although capitalism does play a part. It would be sad if NKorea went capitalism today, because we wouldn't support them and help them off their feet, since it's obviously more important to attack an Iraqi dictator that's making fun of us.

wrong. nkorea and skorea can be reunited. i need only to point to one other country: germany.
it won't be anytime soon, unless nkorea collapses; if it doesn't, it'll be at least ten, twenty more years, i fear.
skorea's economy got its start with the us, but these days, it's getting more and more self-sufficient, and less and less reliant on trade with the us.
as for attacking iraq, that's another thread. but i honestly think all this stupid ruckus could have been avoided had bush used brains and decided he could trust the general public and other national leaders with his reasoning.

By the way, I think you tend to favor the Koreans slightly in arguements, but it might just be a coincidence. I do feel sorry for the Japanese getting nuked, but it was something that had to be done. You compare that to what they did in Korea, so I sense a tone of revenge here. You do feel sorry for them, but there wasn't a better way to defeat them.

revenge? perhaps. there was no better way to defeat them, and there is absolutely no reason to feel sorry for them.

By the way, Laos and Vietnam are communist today because of China's influence. I can understand why you see your leaders as very bad, but I really do not hate Truman at all. He didn't have all of the socialist, liberal policies that FDR imposed on us. I also doubt that Euro history is mentioned a lot in China, or Korea for that matter. Christopher Columbus is like a celebrity in the history books today, even "world history."

i never said that laos and vietnam wouldn't be communist today if it weren't for china. believe me, i know. to be more accurate, i don't hate truman so much as i hate acheson, his moronic secstate who allowed such a division to take place: his reasoning? it seemd to be a nice, even line.
euro history isn't mentioned as much in asia, but they do a lot better job covering it than westerners do about asia.

I just read some of the stuff on your web site. I'm glad to hear you didn't vote for Cynthia Mckinney, but you are very harsh on people that have a difficult time voting.

why shouldn't i be? the directions are clear, plain as day... if you're illiterate, sure you have the right to vote, but one wonders whether you have the foggiest idea of who you're voting for. again, a topic for a different thread.

Since they have voting in Spanish here, it's fair to say that someone that doesn't know any English at all has just as many rights as I do. It is disappointing that some of the illiterates are natural citizens of this country.

i know. they had it where i was too, and i think it's fvcking stupid. the us has one language, and no official government document should need to be translated. you don't speak english, tough cookies. you better learn if you want to communicate. again, a topic for a different thread.

I like the computer voting system, but I hope the 80 year old guy will know how to use it. I didn't vote at all since I don't know anything about the candidates. But based on what you said, I doubt if anyone else does either! At least I don't have autodialers calling me for now, begging for a vote. I didn't bother to vote against CMK because everyone knew she was history anyway.

you wouldn't have been able to vote against her-- you live outside of her district, thus you couldn't. and a lot of people know a little, but not enough. i must confess, i don't know everything about some of those offices--but i at least had the decency to leave those parts blank, and made a note to learn about them for the general election.

And I also saw that you want Japan to apologize to Korea. It would be good for relations, and it would benefit both countries. It just isn't going to happen. If Japan had decided to make ironclad ships, it would be like admitting that Korea had the superior design. Even though Japan lost WWII and its dominance in Korea, they will never apologize because they don't want to admit that they are human too. Looking at some of their anime (DBZ, Pilot Candidate, Gundam) makes me think they are really racist or they think they are the ultimate race, but that's just me.

all asians are racist. it's just a matter of degree, and to whom. nobody likes the japanese, and the japanese like noone. part of the reason why korea loves computer gaming and not console gaming is because there still are lots of trade barriers between japan and korea-- a holdover from a period of bad relations.
that's one thing i'm glad didn't happen at the world cup-- korea facing off against japan. bodies would have gotten hauled off when japan lost.

Another interesting thing. Some Korean history websites talk about the 3 kingdoms period, etc in a very plain way. It's almost like there are no good guys or bad guys in Korea. Over here, we were the good guys in every single war (except the North gets favored in the Civil War chapter . It's so much easier to learn biased history, don't you think?

yep. western textbooks are littered with examples of that, especially towards the beginning of this century, when lots of them spoke of "civilizing" the less-"civilized"-- what with all that "white man's burden" bs that was floating around.

[yin26]

I could write some massive post, here, I suppose ... but I'll stick with one thing about the eating of dogs:

It is not eaten in some kind of clandestine dinner, and while the practice is losing its hold among the younger generation that has had the luxury of owing dogs as pets, there are places to eat it all over Korea. Why?

In general, the belief is that dog meat is very good for one's health. In the same way that people in the U.S. eat chicken soup to cure a cold, Koreans who eat dog meat do so to gain energy, usually during the very hot and humid summers.

I had many chances to eat dog meat, of course, but I couldn't do it. Well, I could, but I felt like I didn't need to. After having seen dog meat in the window still with furry legs and feet (to prove it's actually a dog), I couldn't help but lose interest.

Anyway, to mock or criticise Koreans for eating dog while we eat rabbits, lambs, veal (cows cruelly never allowed to move as they are literally pumped with food), pigs (did you see the movie about the very cute and cuddly pig?) ... well, helps you gain insight as to why certain parts of the world are becoming awfully tired of certain other parts...

[King of Rasslin]

I doubt if those dogs are allowed to eat much either. We have the cleanest meat in our country, and I applaud you for not eating what you have in yours. I hear that they found mad cow disease in Japan now, so it's probably in Korea too.

If you take anyone, and I mean ANYONE, and show them dog meat and a steak, they would take the steak. Dogs would be eaten in North Korea, or for poor people in South Korea that can't afford quality meat. Q and Yin, you 2 are smart so I don't think you would be the poor guys that would eat dog. If I was starving, I would, but I wouldn't eat it just to see what it tastes like.

How is the weather in Korea? Is it really hot, you said? I heard on the news that it was very cold in the Korean War, and conditions were similar to Afghanistan now. Is it like the opposite of Vietnam, in some ways?

And N and S Korea can't really be united because of 1 reason. If people want to live under a tyrannic, despotic, communist dictator that controls every aspect of their lives, let them! They are the ones who allowed them to get in power, so they are happy as it is (think Iraq.) If they love to starve and work 16 hours a day, let them! Apparently, South Koreans are bright enough to know that it isn't fun living under a communist dictator.

Well, the East Germans loved being under Russia too. Maybe it's the Polish blood, why they would allow themselves to be thrown around by a bunch of cossacks. The North Koreans were probably more influenced by the Chinese invasions, so I would think they would see things similarly. The only reason why Germany is united today is because the USSR collapsed.

And I don't see China collapsing any time soon. Sorry.

[Proserpine]

I read this thread, and just couldn't believe what I was seeing.

KOR, just when I think the is a shaft of light among the gloom. You throw out something really dim. You just wrote:

Originally posted by King of Rasslin If people want to live under a tyrannic, despotic, communist dictator that controls every aspect of their lives, let them! They are the ones who allowed them to get in power, so they are happy as it is (think Iraq.)

But recently, you posted:

Originally posted by King of Rasslin
It's actually very sad that they are stuck with a leader that lies to them and controls them by force.

See the contradiction?

As it happens I agree with your first assessment, but the second (and I happen to also agree that China probably won't change soon), but the fact remains that what ever your true position, the above statements are irreconcilable.

You are a perfect example of just about everything that is wrong with the American "system" (I do not say ours is any better, mind). As you are only 17 and appear to live in the backwoods, I forgive you (just). However, as several people have pointed out you have access to the most marvellous research tool ever - please use it to find out the facts, preferably before you post. You mentioned the weather in Korea, fact is it is pretty hot in summer and pretty cold in winter, as you could find out from e.g. CNN. As another example, go find out some facts about the history of the American Civil War - I imagine there are a few things in you local library too, if you have one - and then you can try to convince me if you like (in an OT thread) that the South could have won it. No way! The North wasn't even trying very hard (and most of their generals were useless), and they STILL whupped the South so hard it could never "Rise again" (militarily, that is). If having read, for example, some of the many links posted here, you wish to maintain your position on any specific issue, well that is your right too, but IMO it is always better to speak from knowledge than from ignorance.

You need to learn more of the world. Go stay for awhile, say a year or two, in New York or even Atlanta (you don't have to like it).

By now I think you have probably offended most people (Asians, Europeans, New Yorkers, Australians, to name only a few). Respect the differences and choices of cultures and nations other than your own, and this thread will be a lot less intemperate (though probably not as entertaining.

And finally, in a desperate attempt to get this thread somewhat back On Topic, a couple of minor points to others:
Molly_Bloom - from Joyce or after the pub (or both)?
To anyone, re cuisines of different cultures- I have been to
China and Thailand, and I can honestly say that the taste of the cuisines prepared in those countries bears little relation to anything "Chinese" or "Thai" that I have ever eaten in England. Also, I have noticed that the allegedly "same" cuisine (let's say Thai for sake of argument) tastes different in Germany or France to the same dish in England, even when prepared by say a Thai chef from the best ingredients available. I suspect that it is partly the ingredients are slightly different, and partly that accomodations are "always" made to local tastes. Yes, it is good that restaurants in the major cities offer knowlege of different cuisines, but all the same it is not the same.
Re Kim Chee, I'm with GhengisFarb on this one (and also on the Sauerkraut issue), it just isn't to my taste. However, to each his own. If you enjoy it, eat it, if you haven't tried it maybe you should. I quite like fried scorpions for example (a crunchy snack).
Re: dogs. Enough already. Lets talk about Korean civilisation, its culture and history.

[King of Rasslin]

Well, they are controlled by force by the military, which is ran by the people. It's their choice to live under a dictatorship, and either way it's impossible to be a leader without having the people keep you there.

But you only need about 10% of the people (military, police, etc) to stay in power. They are being oppressed, but they allow it because they get paid very well to keep it that way. On average, every photo of China or North Korea has 2 policemen in the background. They could fight the dictator, but that's their paycheck, so forget about it. From what I have heard of North Korea, a lot of people there really love their leader, same like China.

As for scorpions, or maggots, or spider, etc. Why don't some cultures eat normal food? I mean, the French have to have wine at every meal, the Germans warm beer, the Irish hard liquor, the Russians vodka, and the Japanese sake.

Why can't we all just drink Bud and be normal?

I can't find the date of the Korean declaration of independence. Because Asians used a very inaccurate calendar for a long time, are dates important to them? Dates of events are a huge deal here in the US, so we don't spend time remembering a lot.

[King of Rasslin]

{quote}"Korea is a monoracial country and strongly exclusive of other races, especially of Asians. For instance, we don't have any recognized china town though they are spread over the world. There are few westerners also, so don't be annoyed at Koreans who must stare at you everywhere.
If you're a westerner, you're lucky in Korea. Through the influence of western culture, Koreans admire it unconsciously so they are kind to westerners. They know basic English and they're willing to help you. If you can't easily find someone who can speak English (it's hard in a rural district), try to find a student who usually wears a uniform because she/he learns English in schools for years."{quote}

I found this from a Korean guy talking about Seoul. What does he mean that Korea is monoracial? After Chinese, Mongol, and Japanese invasions, I think they would be a little mixed up, like the English (Celt, Viking, Anglo and Saxon.) I also can't see how they could be exclusive of other Asians, since they look very much alike. Excluding differences in hair color, Euros look the same too, but it's language and culture that separate them.

Does he mean that Koreans are exclusive of other cultures, or can they tell if someone is Chinese or not. After being invaded so often, I would think they would be very tolerable. French is spoken a little in Vietnam because the French colonized it, but who colonized Korea? I'm glad they know English.

[King of Rasslin]

http://www.kimsoft.com./2002/eatdogs.htm

[Proserpine]

Originally posted by King of Rasslin

I found this from a Korean guy talking about Seoul. What does he mean that Korea is monoracial? After Chinese, Mongol, and Japanese invasions, I think they would be a little mixed up, like the English (Celt, Viking, Anglo and Saxon.) I also can't see how they could be exclusive of other Asians, since they look very much alike. Excluding differences in hair color, Euros look the same too, but it's language and culture that separate them.

Does he mean that Koreans are exclusive of other cultures, or can they tell if someone is Chinese or not. After being invaded so often, I would think they would be very tolerable. French is spoken a little in Vietnam because the French colonized it, but who colonized Korea? I'm glad they know English.

Bearing in mind that the Korean persons first language is not english, I thought that wasn't bad. "Monoracial" is probably more accurately rendered as "monocultural", IMO.

Man, they might look alike to you. To each other they look different and its easy to tell the difference between Asian "races" in a general way. We all look alike to them! There has been quite a lot of research on facial recognition (mostly in the context of "mugshots" and police line up identifications), which basically, IIRC shows that black people more easily distinguish other black people, etc.

Korea, as far as I know, was never colonised by the Western powers (post WW2 doesn't count ). Read a history.

[Q Classic]

I doubt if those dogs are allowed to eat much either. We have the cleanest meat in our country, and I applaud you for not eating what you have in yours. I hear that they found mad cow disease in Japan now, so it's probably in Korea too.

it might be, but it's doubtful. i don't know how far the restrictions really go, but even today there are huge trade barriers between korea and japan. that's one reason why nintendo, sony, and sega never really made it big in korea. so i wouldn't be surprised, then, if most meat in korea came from sources not in japan.
there was an outbreak of foot and mouth disease in korea, but that's been happening all over the world, so~

How is the weather in Korea? Is it really hot, you said?

terribly hot and humid in the summer, bitterly cold in the winter. to put it another way, it's got atlanta summers and chicago winters.

And N and S Korea can't really be united because of 1 reason. If people want to live under a tyrannic, despotic, communist dictator that controls every aspect of their lives, let them! They are the ones who allowed them to get in power, so they are happy as it is (think Iraq.) If they love to starve and work 16 hours a day, let them! Apparently, South Koreans are bright enough to know that it isn't fun living under a communist dictator.

well, actually, most of the nkoreans don't want to live under the dictator. if they had any power, they'd definitely try to do something about it, but...
nkorea and skorea can and will be united. it's just a matter of when, and how much it will cost.

The North Koreans were probably more influenced by the Chinese invasions, so I would think they would see things similarly. The only reason why Germany is united today is because the USSR collapsed.

er, not quite. to link ethnicity and political viewpoints is a fallacy. if you really want to do that, you'd actually have to say that koreans and chinese prefer a feudal monarchy, the british a consitutional monarchy, and most of europe a absolute monarchy.
nkoreans just happen to be under the very strong boot of the north korean communist party, one which doesn't give them much chance to see anything at all.

[Q Classic]

As for scorpions, or maggots, or spider, etc. Why don't some cultures eat normal food? I mean, the French have to have wine at every meal, the Germans warm beer, the Irish hard liquor, the Russians vodka, and the Japanese sake.

...normal?
OH! you mean American.
...that kinda gets rid of the entire point of culture.

I can't find the date of the Korean declaration of independence. Because Asians used a very inaccurate calendar for a long time, are dates important to them? Dates of events are a huge deal here in the US, so we don't spend time remembering a lot.

korea's always been independent except for a brief period when it was occupied by the mongols (no need for a declaration of independence there, as soon as genghis died the koreans kicked the mongols out~) and when it was occupied by the japanese.
the date when koreans started a full-scale rebellion and redeclared their independence was 1 Mar 1919.
this date is based on the solar calendar. and you'd be surprised how accurate the lunar calendar really was, and yes, dates are important to asians. most of the important dates tend to be rendered in the lunar calendar, however, such as chusok, the harvest festival, or the lunar new year.
really, in asia, everybody generally knows two calendars, one lunar, and one solar. most calendars sold tend to have both dates written in on the same day-- so you'll have an entry like "1 Nov 2002 ~ x day x month x year", with one being solar and the other lunar.

I found this from a Korean guy talking about Seoul. What does he mean that Korea is monoracial? After Chinese, Mongol, and Japanese invasions, I think they would be a little mixed up, like the English (Celt, Viking, Anglo and Saxon.) I also can't see how they could be exclusive of other Asians, since they look very much alike. Excluding differences in hair color, Euros look the same too, but it's language and culture that separate them.

...ok, see, the thing is, often times asians can tell where other asians are from. if not by appearance, dress, and mannerism, then by name.
also, even with the major invasions, koreans have tended to stick to koreans and having korean children. koreans are actually a good deal less mixed than most other ethnicities-- like the japanese, marriages tend to be only with those of their own kind.

After being invaded so often, I would think they would be very tolerable.

...are you nuts? if anything, you should realize that countries that have been invaded tend to hate the country that invaded them.
vietnam bears no love of france. most of africa doesn't care much for europe. russia hates the mongols. southeast asia despises china.

who colonized Korea?

only the japanese, and only for a period of forty years in which the koreans fought back as much as they could.

I'm glad they know English.

it's expected of all students to learn korean, japanese, and english in their primary education.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Proserpine

Molly_Bloom - from Joyce or after the pub (or both)?

I don't know a pub called Molly Bloom's- I know one at the end of Old Compton Street/Charing Cross Road called Molly Moggs', though...

From Joyce, il miglior fabbro, of course.

And you're spot on about K.O.R.- every time you think he's got something right, he's learned something, he opens his big electronic gob and sticks both feet in.

As someone of Irish descent, I can assure K.O.R. that the Irish do not drink hard liquor with every meal. Nor do they eat potatoes with every meal.

And as for eating normal food... what, like American Cheez Whizz and Oreos and Velveeta? Mmm, haven't had my full dose of artificial flavourings, colourings and gums, must rush out and get some! Twinkie rush anyone? It can save you from a murder conviction...

[Proserpine]

Originally posted by molly bloom

I don't know a pub called Molly Bloom's- I know one at the end of Old Compton Street/Charing Cross Road called Molly Moggs', though...

There is a Molly Bloom's Irish Pub listed on Yahoo at 39 Bay St, Melbourne. As you seem to be of the Australian persuasion, from that city, I thought you might know it. I might visit it myself, just for a laugh, when I am in Melbo in December.

[siredgar]

I cannot believe this thread continues to talk about dog meat in Korea. While I have visited Korea many times, I have NEVER seen anyone eat dog meat nor have I seen anyone ACTUALLY eat dog meat. I have never been offered dog meat and I don't even know what it looks like. So, perhaps I am ignorant on this issue, but I only know a few Koreans who have ever tried it and I know literally HUNDREDS of Koreans.

That's why I say that it must be served in a somewhat clandestine manner. I have heard of dog meat restaurants in the outskirts of town and in rural areas, but you can't find dog meat hot dogs at baseball games or dog meat burgers at fast food stores. It's just not like that. I get FURIOUS when I see a discussion of dog meat pertaining to Korea. Once I met this guy who, when I told him I've been to Korea many times, kept talking on and on about dog meat and asked me about dog meat in Korea. This is not what Korea is about!

Also, King of Rasslin, it is nice to see you actually contribute to the discussion by bringing in Web links. In one of your links, someone stated that dog meat eating in Korea only started really 50 years ago during the Korean War. So, again, this proves that dog meat eating is NOT really a part of Korean culture!!!

[yin26]

There are plenty of dog-meats butchers and restaurants all throughout Seoul. It's no big secret, but then again it's something most Koreans don't go out their way to take you to...

[King of Rasslin]

You know, cows are very cute too! I eat them because they taste good, but you have to not think about what they went through. So, if dog meat tasted as good as steak, I would probably eat it too. But I assume that it tastes very coarse and nasty, otherwise people would be eating it! Same would go for emu, kangaroo, and cats.

Hey, cheeze whiz, oreos,velveeta and twinkies are great! It's better eating that than eating dog meat, you know! I eat what tastes good, and I know my food.

[GhengisFarb™]

Actually, it was my impression that dog-meat was a delicacy somewhat like snails and fungus are to the French.

Believe me, I'd dig in to a dog dish before snails and fungus anyday. But the reason you don't see dog meat in Seoul is the Koreans realize Americans find it distasteful and don't offer it to them as Americans wouldn't be willing to pay the extra amount it costs.

I've had dog, snail, and fungus, and dog meat wasn't bad, I just had a hard time visualizing that I was eating dog.

Now snail and fungus, couldn't recommend those to anybody.

[yin26]

Actually, I don''t think Koreans care a bit what anybody else thinks ... at least in terms of operating a profitable business, be it selling dog meat or cell phones. As I said, there are dog meat and associated eating places all over Seoul in plain view. Of course, you need to read Korean, and most of the signs translate to 'Body Protection Soup,' which includes a variety of soups, including chicken, dog, etc.

But this is understood by the populace. You don't see big signs with a headless dog at the restaurant anymore than you see terrified, bloody cow photos outside of McDonalds ... but does that mean Americans are hiding the cow meat because India would object?

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by GhengisFarb
Actually, it was my impression that dog-meat was a delicacy somewhat like snails and fungus are to the
French....

....Now snail and fungus, couldn't recommend those to anybody.

Well, I've had pasta with white truffles and walnut oil, and I've had snails in paella and even on pizza. And in rosemary and olive oil and garlic.

And I've had Chinese soup with fungus.

I've enjoyed them all- much more so than the substitutes for cavity wall insulation, such as Velveeta and Cheez Whizz. But the important thing to remember is- de gustibus non est disputandum. And as Sir Thomas Beecham said, "Try everything twice, except incest and folk dancing."

[Proserpine]

A question for QCubed (and any one else who cares to answer) . . . what, if anything, is taught in Korea re European history?

I'm just wondering whether the names of leaders, of e.g Viking Civ are likely to be known to Korean players. Not that it matters greatly.

[Capt Dizle]

I thought yin was dead.

[LoneWolf]

Originally posted by jimmytrick
I thought yin was dead.

Actually, I thought Molly Bloom was yin. The self-importance, the arrogance, the narcissism, the rudeness. It all seemed so familiar.

Condescension. I forgot condescension.

[King of Rasslin]

Yep

Mushrooms are fungus, so I would say truffles are ok. I was taught in school that they are not very healthy, and have very few nutrients. Really just a luxury food. Snails are what the dude on "Cast Away" would eat- starve or eat snails. I can't see anyone eating snails because they would be slimy and nasty, and probably full of parasites too.

Paranoia over US meat is just being pushed by desperate Euro ranchers that want the world to believe our meat is as filthy as theirs. Well, mad cow disease says enough on its on. It's been proven that our meat is better, and Hindus hate us because they worship cows and eat goat meat.

[Proserpine]

Originally posted by King of Rasslin
Yep

Mushrooms are fungus, so I would say truffles are ok. I was taught in school that they are not very healthy, and have very few nutrients. Really just a luxury food. Snails are what the dude on "Cast Away" would eat- starve or eat snails. I can't see anyone eating snails because they would be slimy and nasty, and probably full of parasites too.

They're not garden snails! They are specially farmed and in all honesty probably healthier than (most) US beef. They are cooked, so they are not slimy.

Originally posted by King of Rasslin Paranoia over US meat is just being pushed by desperate Euro ranchers that want the world to believe our meat is as filthy as theirs. Well, mad cow disease says enough on its on.

Tell that to Oprah

Originally posted by King of Rasslin It's been proven that our meat is better, and Hindus hate us because they worship cows and eat goat meat.

Proven, by whom, exactly? Nobody hates you (in general), they just get exasperated because you (both generally and specifically) disrespect other cultures, peoples & way of life, which you know nothing at all about, nor seem to be prepared to learn something of before opening your gob(s) to shout that your way is self-evidently best. It isn't. It's just one of a number of possible ways. Before you start that is not the same as stopping (or trying) certain humanitarianly unjustifiable practices.

And if you bother to answer this post, please stick to answering the points made, and if making an assertion state whether it is opinion or fact, and if the latter quote your sources. Thanks. And good night.

[LoneWolf]

I just love seeing Euros in a tizzy. Please continue.