Pina Colada

[Donegeal]

Thanks for posting that Dejon. I was looking for it in the log, but couldn't find it.

[Donegeal]

For everyone's reference, I am against using the build 'Q', so I did not post 'Q' seggestions.

By the way, I call this group of suggestions Flip'em Off.
Turn 0
FAM- Tell Monty to scram (Aztecs in our land by San Cortes).

San Cortes: WF- 1 (change from 2)
Change build to Cathedral (from Library, as Cathedral is cheaper).

Chiquita: WF- no change (n/c)
Cathedral has four turns left and would cost 80 L to rush. Please do so as soon as possible as with the implimentation of San Cortes as a "flipper" city, major culture pressure is now placed on the three Greek cities (Argos, Delphi and Mycenae) as well.

Del Monte: WF- n/c

New York: WF- 1,5,8,9,20 (change 4 to 20)
Change build to Cathedral as this is a "Flipper" city and needs culture to do its job. Again, build Cathedral instead of Library as Cath is cheaper to rush.

Turn 1
San Cortes: WF- n/c
Rush Cath as soon as possible. San Cortes is a VERY important "flipper". City is also still in danger of flipping to the greeks.

Chiquita: WF- n/c
Rush Cath as soon as possible as we are trying to flip SIX (6) cities in the region and prevent the flip of two.

Del Monte: WF- n/c
Builds Marketplace. Switch to Musketmen.

New York: WF- n/c
Rush Cath as soon as possible. NY is almost sole city trying to flip Boston.

Turn 2
San Cortes: WF- n/c
If Cath rushed last turn, builds cath. Switch to Library.

Chiquita: WF- n/c
If Cath rushed, builds cath. Switch to Library.

Del Monte: WF- n/c

New York: WF- grow 1,4,5,8,9,12
If Cath rushed, builds cath. Switch to Library.

Turn 3
No Changes, all around.

Turn 4
San Cortes: WF- grow 1,8
Rush Library if possible.

Chiquita: WF- n/c
Rush Library if possible.

New York: WF- n/c
Rush Library is possible.

Turn 5
San Cortez: WF- n/c
If rushed, build University.

Chiquita: WF- n/c
If rushed, build Uni

New York: WF- n/c
If rushed, build Uni

This turnchat is about nothing but culture in Pina Colada. Much the same as we did with the Persians, we have an advantage here that we should exploit to the fullest. If we push these Cultural improvements here we could gain up to six cities (Boston, Washington, Chicago, Argos, Delphi and Mycenae) in the next 1 or two turnchats, without drawing a single drop of blood. This "Mass Flip" strategety is only possible in the next couple of turnchats as the Greek and Aztecs will be attempting to build up there cities in this area culturally. This is an URGENT matter. So much so, I think I'll start a thread of its own.

[Donegeal]

Congratulations to the new Administration. For future reference, this is where I will post my suggestions and questions to Minister ET reguarding all issues I have with Piña Colada. I recommend to each RA to set up a similar thread for their regions. I welcome any posts from all players for ideas or critism of ideas on the situation in Piña Colada.

[Donegeal]

Originally posted by E_T in the Contractors thread
New York -
1) Road on both flood plains but Irrigate only one now
2) Mine then road on one of the mountians to the east side of the city.
3) then Irrigate the other flood plain or mine & road another mountian, your choice for now.
I'll be limiting the size of New York to 6 until I get needed improvements into place.

This was originally posted in the contractors thread, but am commenting on it here so all can comment on it.

My question is why not switch to Cathedral over courthouse for two reasons:
1) We would not have to limit the size of the city. It could go to size 12 without disorder.
2) I consider NY as a "flipper" city. That means that one of its main goals (in addition to a border city) is the cultural flipping on nearby cities (ie: Boston).

I understand that NY is corrupt and unproductive, but as a flipper city, culture is its top priority. With a Cathedral, we could irrigate both floodplains and not have to worry about taking up movement points to get the worker back up to the floodplain when E_T decides to let the city grow.

For those that didn't realize it, New York is on a river and does not require an aqueduct.

[Donegeal]

Not that anyone cares, but I will be without a computer this weekend and won't be around for a couple of days.

[E_T]

Originally posted by donegeal


This was originally posted in the contractors thread, but am commenting on it here so all can comment on it.

My question is why not switch to Cathedral over courthouse for two reasons:
1) We would not have to limit the size of the city. It could go to size 12 without disorder.
2) I consider NY as a "flipper" city. That means that one of its main goals (in addition to a border city) is the cultural flipping on nearby cities (ie: Boston).

I understand that NY is corrupt and unproductive, but as a flipper city, culture is its top priority. With a Cathedral, we could irrigate both floodplains and not have to worry about taking up movement points to get the worker back up to the floodplain when E_T decides to let the city grow.

For those that didn't realize it, New York is on a river and does not require an aqueduct.

I was thinking about worker time of competions, Production increases and trade before food output. New York will grow fairly fast as it is, and yes, faster still with the added Irrigation in effect. But while it's growing, I'd rather get it's shield output maxed out, despite the waste the it's having.

If we didn't have to worry about clearing a lot of jungle, I'd ask for several worker stacks for each city. But because that's not the case, I've structured the request to maximize the Infrastructure improvements vs. time and manpower.

I've only just recently downloaded the save, and even haven't looked at it (please see my post in today's turnchat thread). I'll be looking at it tonight, if possible, and an All day project tomorrow.

E_T

[Donegeal]

ET said to take the arguements to the Province threads, so here it is:

Originally posted by E_T
NY currently has 85% Corruption & Waste which will become 55% after the courthouse is installed. The Cathedral will be next and will be rushed for a smaller cost than without the Court (out put will be 3 instead of 1, without any additinal Tile Improvements). Infrastructure is being improved their as well and the extra shields will be able to go into production output (namely the Cath) would be an advantage. I'll link in my Corruption Statistics Post as soon as I get it up.

Ok, so are you going to rush the Courthouse imediately then switch to cathedral and rush after one turn of production? It doesn't make any sence! A courthouse has no cultural effect and is usless here until we have the proper cultural improvements rushed. I see no reason to build the courthouse before the cathedral. We need to rush the cath then we can throughput the courthouse.

There is a sense of urgentcy with the cathedral, and none with the court. Please give me a GOOD argument to building a court first, as have yet to see one.

[Donegeal]

OMG! Now E_T has gone and delayed the production of the cathedral even further to build a worker! Yes I know workers are important, but he has failed to even adaquately justify building a courthouse before a cathedral, much less bumping it even further down the build "Q".

In the 700 ad Orders thread MWIA said something about trying to make the job of CP easier. Listen to the RAs! All RAs do is look at their province. They know everything going on in their province.

Every suggestion I have made has been ignored by E_T and without justification. If it wern't for my continued love for the Piña Colada Province and dedication to the sucsess of this demo game I would resign as RA. As it stands, I was going to wait for E_T to post his "CP Policy", but asit is clearly displayed already, I will formerly decline the post of Deputy CP that was offered to me. I want nothing to do with ET as the MoCP as his "policy' has turned out to be stubborness.

Rest assured to the rest of the people of Apolytonia, I will continue to post my ideas and I will continue to RP the role in Piña Colada. (There's nothing in the CoL or NewCon that can keep me from RP)

[UnOrthOdOx]

Donegeal, perhaps we could begin an amendment process to officially distribute power to RA's? Start a info poll, see how much support would be for such a system. It is not too late to alter the NewCon, or amend the current CoL...

[Donegeal]

I was actually thinking that in the NewCon, the Domestic Minister NOT set up a Deputy of City Planning, but select RA's that officially do the job for the Minister. These RA's could then be "approved" by the senate much like Justices are approved by congress in the US (they could even be permenate if so desired). The DM would then oversee (and ultimatly) and be help responible for the the actions of the RA's. He could tell the RA "I need three workers and two WC in the next two turnchats; And the SMC have requested two defensive units in this city and that city". The RA would then arange and actually Administer his province to produce these results. The RA would put forth rush requests to the Prez/senate and make PW request to the DM or whoever he sets up as Deputy of PW. The DM would be an overseeer.

[Donegeal]

Lord Donegeal sits at his desk with papers strewn all over, musing about the current situation of Apolytonia.
"So many decisions to make! Operation Flip'em off; War with France; Rumors of other great civilizations across the Great Meshelician Ocean , A possible golden age of Apolytonia, the new Administration, The NewCon coming into effect. Its enough to make a guy pull his hair out!"

Donegeal pushes his chair back, stands, and motions to a person standing in the corner shadows to come towards him.

"Come here Abe, I have to go."

As the former American ruler steps forward, a man comes bursting through the enormous double doors of this Courthouse office with a look of excitement on his face. He rushes to Donegeal pleading with him to stop what he is doing.

Donegeal holds up a hand; "stop right there and count to twenty. We don't want all this excitement to give poor old Abe here a heart-attack!" He puts his hand down and proceeds to piss in the bucket that Abe is holding. As this happens, a look of dread crosses onto the excited mans face.

"Ahhh... Thank you Abe. Its good to know your still good for something. Now what was it that was so important?"

My Lord, its your mother. Her condition has gotten worse. This Mad Jungle disease is in its final stages. However, she was able to piece together a last thing for you to know."

"...and...?"

"Well, the man who raised you was not your father. You are apparently the Love child of a man your mother had an affair with."

"hmmmm...." Donegeal says looking confused. "My father isn't my Father? Well, who the hell is my father?!"

The man looks down at the floor, does not speak, but raises his hand and points to none other than the old man holding onto the bucket.

Donegeal stares at Abe as Abe stares at him. The similarities become evident. The strong jaw. The deep eyes. "Oh my Bananas..."

He reaches for the bucket and hands it to the man who just presented the news.

"Father?"

"Son?"

They embrace. Centuries of conflict instantly melt away as a new father-son bond is formed.

"I am old and unpopular to the people of Piña Colada, Donegeal. Let them continue to embrace you as their leader, but let them embrace you as the Prince that you are!"

[Laertes]

Now the circle is complete

[E_T]

Originally posted by donegeal
OMG! Now E_T has gone and delayed the production of the cathedral even further to build a worker! Yes I know workers are important, but he has failed to even adaquately justify building a courthouse before a cathedral, much less bumping it even further down the build "Q".

In the 700 ad Orders thread MWIA said something about trying to make the job of CP easier. Listen to the RAs! All RAs do is look at their province. They know everything going on in their province.

Every suggestion I have made has been ignored by E_T and without justification. If it wern't for my continued love for the Piña Colada Province and dedication to the sucsess of this demo game I would resign as RA. As it stands, I was going to wait for E_T to post his "CP Policy", but asit is clearly displayed already, I will formerly decline the post of Deputy CP that was offered to me. I want nothing to do with ET as the MoCP as his "policy' has turned out to be stubborness.

Rest assured to the rest of the people of Apolytonia, I will continue to post my ideas and I will continue to RP the role in Piña Colada. (There's nothing in the CoL or NewCon that can keep me from RP)

From my 720AD Orders Post:

New York - Dump Queue, Change build to Cathedral, Add Wrk-Court-WC-Lib to the Queue.

I am not inflexible, and do listen to the arguments. As we will most likely not have the funding to rush that Cathedral this Gameplay, it won't be until after 770AD when It will be rushed. I was trying to save us some money overall, as I'll now have to Rush that Courthouse after 900AD (for a large sum too). We will have WLKD with the Cathedral, but that only effects Production Waste. I was looking to have the courthouse effects on both trade & Production, but that will be a while away now.

The nice thing about build Queues, IS that they CAN BE CHANGED! They allow showing a schedual of what is to most likely be coming up for build in the future. They can be changed as the circumstanses and needs change.

Donegeal, I'd rather have you working with me, than against me. I do value your insight and your devotion to your region, but please try to remember, I have the Nation as a Whole to think about.

E_T

[Donegeal]

Thank you for changing the build in NY E_T. Sorry if I was too harsh there, but I was becoming exceeding frustrated with the situation.

Originally posted by E_T
Donegeal, I'd rather have you working with me, than against me. I do value your insight and your devotion to your region, but please try to remember, I have the Nation as a Whole to think about.

Thank you again. I was begining to believe you thought of me as just a grunt.

Originally posted by E_T
The nice thing about build Queues, IS that they CAN BE CHANGED! They allow showing a schedual of what is to most likely be coming up for build in the future. They can be changed as the circumstanses and needs change.

And since we cannot forsee the circumstances, I would choose to not use "Q's" since they only cause controversy and the next build item can be discussed without someone feeling like the descision has already been made.

[Donegeal]

Originally posted by Fergus Horkan
Now the circle is complete

The circle is NOT complete! Just wait till I become KING of Piña Colada!

[Meshelic]

Originally posted by donegeal
Lord Donegeal sits at his desk with papers strewn all over, musing about the current situation of Apolytonia.
"So many decisions to make! Operation Flip'em off; War with France; Rumors of other great civilizations across the Great Meshelician Ocean

I like the sound of that. Great Meshelician Ocean Has a nice ring to it, eh?

[Meshelic]

Wait a minute! Abe ---> donegeal.......donegeal ----->Abe

this is quite a dramatic turn of events!

[E_T]

Originally posted by donegeal
Thank you for changing the build in NY E_T. Sorry if I was too harsh there, but I was becoming exceeding frustrated with the situation.

You should look at it from my point of view.

Thank you again. I was begining to believe you thought of me as just a grunt.

No, I don't think that, but I do have to look at everything, everywhere.

And since we cannot forsee the circumstances, I would choose to not use "Q's" since they only cause controversy and the next build item can be discussed without someone feeling like the descision has already been made.

The Queue's actually make things easier on me. Yes, as circumstances change, we might have to change some things. But I can also look at everything and quickly decide to make whatever changes are needed, depending on the overall picture.

Say, Germany decides to invade, through Nepoloton. I would change the surrounding cities to reflect what was needed. But at the same time, Cities that were far away would only have minor changes or none at all, depending on the severity of the invasion and our readyness to meet it.

Another thing about the Queue's, they allow anyone to see what the overall plan is. If they are concerned with our Military readiness, they can see what planned Mil Units are in the works. If they want more workers, to help clear the Jungle, they see that we are addressing that issue. If they feel that we need more Science, then they can look and find Libraries and maybe Universities planned and when they would come up for build. The same with cash flow & Marketplaces/Banks. Even though these things aren't being built now and could be Many turns away, they feel that we are GOING someplace. It's kind of Pyschological and really a good thing when dealing with a large, diverse crowd of people. The only difference between a Thoughtful Democracy and Mob Rule is the amount of Information that is readily available.

E_T

[Donegeal]

Ah... my 500th post. I finialy get to pick a personalized avatar. Any suggestions?