Why the US has to be and should be "imperialist"

[Zero]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
Sava:

Once again...

Japanese act imperialistically in Korea... Koreans become second-class citizens of the Japanese Empire with no hope of being accepted into the ethnic state that is Japan.

US acts imperialistically in Korea. Koreans will be equals to Americans and be accepted into a multi-national state that has a history of accepting people of various ethnicities

Multi-national states are better... Achaemid Persia, Rome, Ottoman Empire...


thanks

actually, koreans were one of the few ethnic group that they tried to assimilate. They were given japanese names and forbidden to speak korean (to erase korean identity)

[Al B. Sure!]

Calc II:

Alright but that is also another point... the Japanese amazingly managed to be willing to accept Koreans but only through an intense Japanese-izing of Koreans... that's not quite acceptance


thnaks

[Sava]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

Quote:

multi-national state? You do know of course, that the percentages of our government officials don't translate into equal ratios of the actual US population.

That made no sense whatsoever...

Leave it to Sava to make Speer look like a genius!

the ratio of ethnicities of our government officials...

I've had a long day of work, and I'm moving on Saturday, give me a break.

[Al B. Sure!]

oh yeah and Sava...

you are forgetting the US is majoritarian. if everyone in the US voted based on their race, everyone in gov't will be caucasion as whites are the majority.

having minority groups get population proportionate representation will not happen under the sort of republic the US is.

but of course, people don't usually vote along racial lines (sometimes they do but not always) so gov't officials will be a little bit more diverse. and the racial identity of politicians has little effect on gov't policies. Political leaders in the 60's was mostly white but they still passed civil rights legislation


thanks

[Sava]

Yeah, and how many Korean Senators are there? Congress people? How about Korean presidents? Or Korean CEO's?

yeah... that's equality for you

Compare the demographics of the richest 1% of Americans with the rest of the population, and you'll find that this multi-national, "We are the World", land of equality that you think the US is... doesn't exist.

[Zero]

Thats why they protested. Also, even while they were trying to assimilate, Japanese were racist to them. So it wasnt a exactly all out assimilation during World War II. But the whole government's intention was to eventually dissipitate the difference between koreans and japanese in the long run i guess.

Most Korean elders on that are on my dad's family side has inferiority complex. I think this is because they've been propagandized to death to be embarrassed of korean culture, in order to give up korean identity. That would explain why they dont like the japanese so much.

[Zero]

I think I know one korean congressman!~ (clap clap) mY dad wont shut up talking about this korean man in US politics.

By the way, ratio of ethnic group in goverment does not have to reflect ratio of the population. To make it extreme, you are then sggesting affirmative action or even a quote on government official. Crazy talk!!!

[Pekka]

Ok if that's the real question... chinese, japanese, russians or americans.... NEVER! I will die fighting .
The real question is when we're going to start expanding.. and then my american friends.. you get to be part of our racial nation .
We won't expand to China though.. they'll be our enemies, because what's a world without enemies.

[Al B. Sure!]

Sava:

compare the demagraphics of the poorest 10% of Americans and you will see they are roughly proportionate by population (well except American Indians who are disproportionately impoverished but that's another story)


thanks

[Sava]

"roughly"... but that only means that our country is lead by evil, rich white people that are smart enough to know that they've got to keep a lot of their white brethren poor in order to not draw suspicion.

America is about assimilation. It only accepts your culture as long as you keep it to yourself.

[Zero]

Originally posted by Pekka

We won't expand to China though.. they'll be our enemies, because what's a world without enemies.

You cant unite without a common cause. and common cause often requires common enemies. Look at world war II. US allaince lineup: Mao, Ho Chi Minh, Stalin. YEAH!

[Al B. Sure!]

rich white people? more like rich jews...

but what the hell does 1% being rich matter? They have little effect on the mainstream of American society


thanks

[Sava]

your true colors eventually surface you nazi ****er... I'm done talking with you...

[Al B. Sure!]

what the hell?

[Al B. Sure!]

Sava:

it may be true that 1% of the richest are disproportionately of a certain ethnic group... but that has little bearing on the mainstream of american society. 1% do not determine the ideas of a nation. When you examine the demagraphics of the largest economic class in America (the lower middle class), you will see that they are proportionate with the population. This is the core of American society and the core is proportionate


thanks

[Sava]

Who owns the media in the US?
Who owns the record companies in the US?
Who owns the movie production studios in the US?
Who owns the TV production studios in the US?
Who owns the sports franchises in the US?
Who owns the major corporations in the US?
Who owns the advertising and marketing industries in the US?

These are the people that control our country. They control what we watch, they control what we wear, they control the news we are exposed to, they choose our presidential candidates through a complex lobbying system. If you can't see this, then you need to take the "Red Pill" (Alice in Wonderland/Matrix reference) and hopefully you can see how the world works. But I'm sure you'll sit in front of your computer, spouting off racist, fascist conservative crap without bothering to learn about the issues that you are ignorant about.

Am I perfect? no... Am I ignorant to a great many things that happen? Sure... but I sure as hell don't go calling rich people "Jews..." It sounds like you are in the "there's a rich jewish conspiracy" camp.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
stupidest thread ever

Speer really attracted the dumbarses with this one.

[Guardian]

Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
Well the USA's state of social advancement compared to the rest of the world would definitely be improved if we didn't have moronic nazis like AS in our country.

Shi, that was some of your finest work. If not ever, then at least so far this year!

[Seeker]

"The United States is, without a doubt, the most socially advanced society in the world..."

I skipped the rest of the thread after I saw this.

Unfortunately, this sort of arrogance is not confined to AS, I have heard US servicemen say the same thing in Itaewon bars, thus endearing all non-Americans in listening distance to American 'greatness'.

[Guardian]

Originally posted by Seeker
"The United States is, without a doubt, the most socially advanced society in the world..."

I skipped the rest of the thread after I saw this.

Unfortunately, this sort of arrogance is not confined to AS, I have heard US servicemen say the same thing in Itaewon bars, thus endearing all non-Americans in listening distance to American 'greatness'.

A truly great man doesn't need to boast...

[Az]

What a racist thread...

[Demerzel]

Originally posted by Ned
I think the European Union has a good track record on expansion. However, they recently turned down Turkey. Does this indicate that the Europeans do not want to be associated with non-Christian cultures?

Turkey has been rejected in the past and at the recent enlargement talks was still not given a date for the start of talks for entry into the EU because of its human rights and economic problems. Until they improve that they won't be allowed in, when they do - I'm sure they'll be welcomed in happily even though technically they aren't really European

Now for something that amuses me...

Quote of Chris Patten ( EU's External Affairs Commissioner ) as quoted from CNN

"Most of us have lost count of the numbers of times American officials have offered Turkey membership of the EU. I sometimes think that perhaps we should offer Mexico membership of the United States"

[Arrian]

stupidest thread ever

I agree with the sentiment... but EVER? Wow. I haven't been posting on OT long enough to make such a bold statement, but I'll take your word for it (on this, and nothing else, you commie you).

What's kinda amusing is that I think I now "get" the key part of what Speer was trying to say. That an empire which begins with a country that does not define its nationality primarly by ethnicity is better than one that does. Even if that's true, however, it doesn't change the fact that Imperialism is a terrible idea.

Great, I'm continuing to participate in the stupidest thread ever. *sigh*

-Arrian

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Speer really attracted the dumbarses with this one.

Interesting post there

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Originally posted by Demerzel


"Most of us have lost count of the numbers of times American officials have offered Turkey membership of the EU. I sometimes think that perhaps we should offer Mexico membership of the United States"

Now that was a good one

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
Interesting post there

I rest my case now that you're here UR.

[David Floyd]

(1) A free press. Of course people say it has a free press; but you try living somewhere like New Zealand, where I come from and you will be amazed at the difference. *Surprisingly, I have been very critical of the NZ press considering that the UN ranks it as one of the World's freest - twice as free as the US).

Well, most of the press is either left-leaning or right-leaning, same as the American public, so I'll grant you that one.

(2) A functioning democracy.

Although the US election process is generally corrupt in many ways, a fail to see what's so great about democracy.

(3) A welfare state.

Hell, a welfare state would make this place WORSE, not better, in that higher taxes mean the government steals more of my money. I'm never gonna be on welfare, so why should I want a welfare state? Not only that, but even if I were gonna be on welfare, I still wouldn't support it, because it's a violation of people's rights.

More to the point: in New Zealand I have never seen a homeless person.

OK, but how does that justify the government taking money away from you? I see homeless people every day, yet if the government tried to pass some tax increase to build housing for their alcoholic asses, I'd be pissed off. Most of these people are homeless due to their own bad decisions.

OK, some of them are probably homeless due to the government - drafting them for Vietnam and making people go there really ****ed some people up, so the government was in the wrong there. But actually, people who were drafted had a choice - they didn't have to go murder the Vietnamese just because the government said they did.

(4) A realistic perspective on patriotism.

Granted.

(1) Slaves: well, illegal workers aren't technically slaves, but they don't enjoy any of the rights of citizens and are basically tolerated as an underclass. Forced labourers in prison however are slaves - there is just no other way of looking at it.

Granted.

(2) Religious lunatics with political clout.

Granted.

(3) Appalling rates of violent crime and poverty.

Granted again - just realize that much of this crime and poverty is due to government immorality such as the War on Drugs.

But I don't support more taxes to get people out of poverty.

(4) An idiotic lottery system in which a few citizens win millions of dollar while others pay exorbitant ticket prices - it's icalled "suing".

Nothing's wrong with the lottery - it's totally voluntary. I do agree that we need tort reform, though.

(5) A President who can't read properly and didn't know where most the world's geostrategically important countries were before he was elected. He's now planning to bomb some of them.

Agreed - Bush is a moron.

(6) A war on black people (called the "war on drugs" - wink wink).

So your assertion is that only black people do drugs, and, not only that, because they are black they have to do drugs? Sounds racist to me. Don't get me wrong, the War on Drugs is absolutely immoral, but not because it targets black people - it's targeting black people because they do drugs, not because they're black.

(7) Dull and silly sports that no one else in the world plays and an effeminate version of football played in full body armour (ever played Rugby League? - a man's game).

I guess you've never heard of MMA

[Az]

. But actually, people who were drafted had a choice - they didn't have to go murder the Vietnamese just because the government said they did.

I'll remember this quote for the Nazi Germany threads.

[David Floyd]

I'll remember this quote for the Nazi Germany threads.

I don't mean to say we should try them for murder, I mean to say that they didn't have to go fight.

And you are correct, the Germans did not have to go fight either, although the reason we should not punish them for doing so is because that gives them no way out of the situation - either they get shot for refusing the draft, or get shot/imprisoned for acceding to it. It's basic fairness.

For those who volunteered for the war (any offensive war) they probably are guilty of murder, at least morally.

[The Mad Viking]

[quote]My point EXACTLY... an ethnic state like Japan must never be imperialist because, for example, Manchurians would never be accepted into Japanese society. Any imperialism done by such an ethnic state will be racist.

The United States, however, being a multi-national state, if it does act imperialistically, would do so in a way where the citizens of the 'vassal' would be fully embraced [quote]


Yes, I'm sure all the Arab-Americans who have been embraced into seclusion cells with no charges laid would agree with you.