PCZONE review. Another nail?

JimMac · January 11, 2003, 15:17

Hi,

PC Zone, the UK’s “Biggest Selling Computer Games” magazine has this month given PTW a poor score>55/100.

The on-line version;(Which I think you can read once before being asked to register)-
http://www.computerandvideogames.com...y.php?id=85500

Upon reading the text, the reviewer appears quite sympathetic to Firaxis ;-

“There is little doubt that Firaxis will iron out all these problems with more patches in the coming weeks, but for now at least, the multiplayer setup still needs a lot of work and will almost certainly frustrate those of you who want to log on and start a game with a minimum of fuss. The real shame is it's actually quite playable and engrossing if you can get, and maintain, a steady connection”

I guess the multiplayer flaws required such a low score.

The real unfortunate thing is- I know that some people will have their purchasing decisions swayed by the ratings in PC Zone.

Jim

alva · January 11, 2003, 15:45

I guess we have been through this, no need to do it again.

WarpStorm · January 11, 2003, 17:28

The real question is not how it's being reviewed, but rather how it's selling. If it is selling enough, Infogrames may consider extending the Civ line rather than cancelling it. Infogrames is only concerned about the bottom line.

Fried-Psitalon · January 11, 2003, 19:25

Offhand, I'd say it must be selling pretty decently. They'll extend it to Civ 4- remember, it's only the expansion that there is some debate about. Civ 3 (non-expansion) earned quite good reviews. Honestly, I think these reviewers need to plug around a bit more... I ran an 8 player Direct IP game last night to its conclusion just fine, and my computer/connection, while good, is nothing staggering.

Alex · January 13, 2003, 07:57

WarpStorm hit the nail in the head. If PTW is selling well, then we can hope for a Civ4 in the future.

Aro · January 13, 2003, 08:48

I really hope so... I just love this game (despite all problems).

MarkG · January 13, 2003, 09:07

civ3 is still being sold for $39.99, 14-15 months after release, and they still havent announced anything about a gold package.

it's not on the top 10 lists(where there is only room for sims, a couple of huge real time titles and the usually crazy stuff(zoo tycoon!)), but it must be selling....

additional note: civ3 was in the top 10 until march, and in the monthly top 20 until june

/me thinks it has probably made it's "enough to make civ4" money....

statusperfect · January 13, 2003, 09:09

Any lnows how much PtW is selling?

MarkG · January 13, 2003, 09:23

ptw was in the top 10 for a single week and didnt make it in the top 20 of that month(november 02)
http://apolyton.net/news/search.php?...2=civilization

Panag · January 13, 2003, 09:26

Quote:

Originally posted by statusperfect
Any lnows how much PtW is selling?

hi ,

it depens where you are , from 29.95 with free shipping to 55.75 without shipping and customs , .....

infogrames has different prices all over europe

the best and fastest way to know the price is to look at the CIV III section of this site

have a nice day

Datajack Franit · January 14, 2003, 11:42

Selling it in Italy as well would raise its sales a bit, as almost all my friends returned it to the store they bought it from as they own the original english version and there's not a single word written on the package mentioning that PTW won't work- even though civIII was released 90% in english only! how could you sell the game in english and the expansion in a different language?

Alex · January 14, 2003, 13:17

Quote:

Originally posted by Datajack Franit
Selling it in Italy as well would raise its sales a bit, as almost all my friends returned it to the store they bought it from as they own the original english version and there's not a single word written on the package mentioning that PTW won't work- even though civIII was released 90% in english only! how could you sell the game in english and the expansion in a different language?

A typical Infograme$ stupidity.

alva · January 14, 2003, 16:36

Whoever pushed for the early release will have alot of explaining to do, to his boss IMO.

Panag · January 15, 2003, 00:45

Quote:

Originally posted by alva
Whoever pushed for the early release will have alot of explaining to do, to his boss IMO.

hi ,

, well what about the guys then who knew about the problems and dont care to fix them , months on , .......

if the would have only tought to what the creators had to say , it would have saved a great deal of trouble , ....

have a nice day

WarpStorm · January 15, 2003, 06:36

Quote:

Originally posted by panag

, well what about the guys then who knew about the problems and dont care to fix them , months on

The guys at Firaxis have been working on fixing bugs and making improvements diligently since before PTW has come out. There is only so much that a few guys can do. Eventually the money allocated to it will dry up and they will have to move on to other projects.

Oerdin · January 15, 2003, 07:06

This story or ones like it have been playing sense PtW came out. I think everyone knows what they are getting before they buy it and more reviews like this isn't going to change someone's mind.

Cesa · January 15, 2003, 12:29

/me is still waiting for PTW to be released in Sweden.....(!)

Panag · January 16, 2003, 11:23

Quote:

Originally posted by Cesa
* Cesa is still waiting for PTW to be released in Sweden.....(!)

hi ,

what

, there are copies around in europe with an intro in swedish , but dont buy them anyway , look at the front page of CIV III on this site , order one for 25 USD , it shall be there faster and you shall have a US copy , great for patches

have a nice PTW day

Cesa · January 16, 2003, 15:15

Quote:

Originally posted by panag

hi ,

what

, there are copies around in europe with an intro in swedish , but dont buy them anyway , look at the front page of CIV III on this site , order one for 25 USD , it shall be there faster and you shall have a US copy , great for patches

have a nice PTW day

What do you mean by "intro in swedish"? Normally games aren't translated to swedish, only the boxes and sometimes the manuals. (there are a few exceptions, Black&White was translated, but since original Civ3 wasn't, why would PTW??)

Anyway, it wouldn't surprise me a bit if it has been ready (box and perhaps other parts translated) for the swedish market since december, but Infogrames don't want it to be released for unknown reasons...

And I don't want to buy it from US, the shipping will probably cost as much as PTW itself...

FNBrown · January 16, 2003, 16:14

Quote:

Originally posted by MarkG
civ3 is still being sold for $39.99, 14-15 months after release, and they still havent announced anything about a gold package.

it's not on the top 10 lists(where there is only room for sims, a couple of huge real time titles and the usually crazy stuff(zoo tycoon!)), but it must be selling....

additional note: civ3 was in the top 10 until march, and in the monthly top 20 until june

* MarkG thinks it has probably made it's "enough to make civ4" money....

Hey... I've bought Zoo Tycoon. It's not bad... but it does get a tad monotonous after a while. Basically, it's "Sim Zoo." One reason it might be selling so well is that it has a broader appeal to women (my wife digs it).

Back on the original topic - I think that there will indeed be a Civ4... it might be a few years, but it's bound to happen. As for who would program it, and who would publish it... I have no clue. If Rise of Nations is any good, it might be nice to see Big Huge Games take a crack at it... but I'm not holding my breath.

Panag · January 17, 2003, 15:58

Quote:

Originally posted by Cesa

What do you mean by "intro in swedish"? Normally games aren't translated to swedish, only the boxes and sometimes the manuals. (there are a few exceptions, Black&White was translated, but since original Civ3 wasn't, why would PTW??)

Anyway, it wouldn't surprise me a bit if it has been ready (box and perhaps other parts translated) for the swedish market since december, but Infogrames don't want it to be released for unknown reasons...

And I don't want to buy it from US, the shipping will probably cost as much as PTW itself...

hi ,

if you would follow the link from the first civ3 page on this site you would see that shipping is free , .....

now , there are boxes in europe that have on the back the four scandinavian flags , it also says they have an intro in those languages , ......

and when it comes to support down under , ..... you have a better chance of buying the US version , its not only faster but you get the patch right away when it comes out and when it comes to comp language , ....

have a nice US PTW day

Cesa · January 18, 2003, 05:43

Shipping is free you say..sounds interesting, very interesting

Thank you!

Panag · January 21, 2003, 12:46

Quote:

Originally posted by Cesa
Shipping is free you say..sounds interesting, very interesting

Thank you!

hi ,

well here are some facts , in most countries the game goes for around 40 USD / EURO so , order it for 25 , shipping is free , even if you would have to pay tax on it , it can be more then 15 , ...... and last but not least you have the US version , the one version that seems to be compatible with most OS systems even ones in other languages

have a nice day

David Murray · January 23, 2003, 06:18

Quote:

* MarkG thinks it has probably made it's "enough to make civ4" money....

Where is that Sid Meier quote about another version of Civ in ten years? It was on the frontpage ages ago. Sid Meier was saying that he didn't really expect to release another version of Civilization but it might be a distant possibility.

Of course, you have to ask yourself...what could they add to another turn based game? I think it's probably more likely that Firaxis will use the money to move into realtime. Which is a shame, but I don't particularly see the need for future versions of Civilization.

(SimCity 4 is a good example of how sequels can be big letdowns)

olaf · January 23, 2003, 17:46

I despise the trend towards real time.

I read today that the TB part of the Total War games is gone as of the next one.

Despite the trend, I would bet money that *someday* there will be a TB Civ4. Even with the PTW fiasco and it getting pretty mundane reviews, the franchise still can pull in a lot of sales.

olaf

LaRusso · January 26, 2003, 18:25

Quote:

Originally posted by MarkG
* MarkG thinks it has probably made it's "enough to make civ4" money....

methinks too

after all, apolyton needs something to feed on

Velociryx · January 26, 2003, 22:53

TBS isn't going anywhere...

Besides, all those frantic mouse-clickers need SOMETHING to do while they're recovering from carpel-tunnel syndrome, and there's a TON more that can be done in the genre.....as computers get more and more advanced, it will become increasingly possible to model an increasingly complex society AND keep player micro-management to a minimum. Let's face it....the societal model in ANY civ-type game on the market today sucks wind! Generic "citizens" who are either happy or unhappy? And a "universal bandaid" that makes all citizens happy?

I contend that this area alone would keep the genre occupied for quite some time to come!

And then there's the prospect of creating a truly robust economic model in-game (let's face it, civ's trade options are cute, but in no way do justice to the complexity and intricacy that's possible).

Combat - Another thing that TBS can truly excel at over RTS. Of course, given the pencil-thin combat models that most TBS, Civ-style games use, you hardly notice, but it's possible to get really deep without a lot of MM (play People's General by SSI, and you'll quickly see what I mean).

Tech trees - the whole linear progression of technology is way off base from reality (and yep...at present, my own game project is just as guilty as everybody else!)....MUCH could be done in this area!

And a whole slew of others!

Now...the trick is to synthesize all of these elements into an immersive game framework WITHOUT killing the player with trivial decisions and tons of MM, but don't count the genre out just yet! There are lots of people working on the problem, and WHEN they find ways to extend and expand the current model, you can bet the commercial houses will get in on the act!

-=Vel=-

Coracle · January 26, 2003, 23:14

Quote:

Originally posted by Alexnm
WarpStorm hit the nail in the head. If PTW is selling well, then we can hope for a Civ4 in the future.

Excuse me for stating the obvious, but I have no interest in a Civ 4 if Firaxis does it. Why?

Forget for the moment everything else we discussed and argued about ad nauseam for over a year here. Forget the bugs, the AI, the patches, etc.

The fact is Civ 3 was so disappointing in terms of realsim and history, so much a step backwards from Civ 2, I found it woefully unsatisfactory. The unit values alone were stupid: rifle-armed cavalry and knights with the same defense factor? Elephants that can airlift? Ridiculous. Post-gunpowder unit values were WAY too low. Naval warfare was especially bad and simplistic. And so on.

Of course, if you care nothing about history and even attempting to simulate reality, you don't care, but Civ 3 is more a fantasy game than a history game to me. That is not what I was led to expect.

Panag · January 27, 2003, 08:46

hi ,

CIV III is probably going to get at least one expansion pack , ..... maybe two , .....

then years later , around 2005 - 2006 we are going to get CIV IV

with a whole bunch of civ games from a different breath inbetween , .....

have a nice day