Beta Release Notes, Observations, Questions

Velociryx · January 28, 2003, 11:09

As we draw closer to the public beta, it's time to bring that more to the fore, and start kicking around some notions, ideas, theories, and other stuff, so let me begin by outlining what the Open Beta will, and will not be, and then, we'll let the conversation go where it will from there!

In my mind, here is the minimum requirements our team MUST meet, in order that the game be considered "ready" for an Open Beta:

* Alpha Graphics in place - This includes terrain, army markers, and provincial improvements.

Where we are:
We have approximately half the terrain finished, though we are still working on the best methodology for displaying hills, mountains, and forests (as tiles, or as overlays) - I have mockups of the half that's not finished, but am holding off on further refinements on them till we hammer out how, precisely, it will be displayed. This should present no difficulties whatsoever in terms of finishing it out into a playable state. Likewise, the "army icon" is a simple one to finish...the plan being to start with one to get us up and running, and add additional "army markers" as the game matures further, to provide a variety of "looks." Where provincial improvements are concerned, we have 14 of the 16 improvements rendered and converted to tile-size for our use. These are currently being tweaked and improved on (and there has been some discussion about the possibility of moving away from having tile-based improvements, to having map sprite based improvements, which would give us an enormous amount of added flexibility with them). For the moment, this is our crowning achievement, and we need but two more advanced improvements to have this in a working state (Academy and University, both of which are in concept stage on my machine at home).

* Music - Main title theme and battle music, at a minimum
Where we are:
I consider this absolutely essential to the gaming experience, and IMO, one of the biggest weaknesses in the vast bulk of indie projects. Skimp here, and it LOOKS like an indie project. Of course, I have also discovered WHY this is so...acquiring the rights to good music is not a trivial expense, and takes an enormous amount of time in the search for "just the right sound." Nonetheless, I feel that this is absolutely essential to turning out a quality product, and there's no room for skimping. Skimp, and you may as well run without sound entirely, IMO.

I have acquired both our title theme and battle music, so in this regard, we're ready to roll, though later, I'd very much like to add alternate tracks...dunno tho, it ain't cheap, but we'll see.

As to the quality of both....

You'll have to wait to hear and judge for yourself, but it's been getting thumbs up all around from the team!

* Main map display

Where we are:
See the latest "pre-screenie" in the art thread here at 'poly. It's not quite done yet, but it's getting close. The thinking is that this will be where players spend the vast bulk of their time, so this screen has got to be rich and visually appealing, without crossing the line into loud and obtrusive. 90% complete, or thereabouts.

* Game Start Screen

Where we are:
This is in mock-up stage only, but should not be overly difficult to finish off. Another screen of vital importance, because it's what you see first, and every time you play. If it's not right, we work on it till it is. Expect to see pre-screenies soon.

* Other game menus and screens

Where we are:
Mock-ups only, and for a specific reason - In order for this process to be complete, we NEED player input. The plan is to design mockups for the major displays, and make use of player input to refine them till they're exactly what you want/need in the game. Just like we relied heavily on player input from these forums to draw our ideas around concepts you guys sugessted, we'll be doing the same thing with the menus and screens. In the end, YOU will be the driving force behind the final look of our menus.

* Completion - The goal is that the game be playable from start to finish on the day we release the beta

Where we are:
It may not be pretty yet, but you CAN play the game from start to finish. There's no fanfare at the end....no triumphant victory music or anything, but you can do it. We'll dress it up as we go (and prolly strongly influenced by what you want to see at the end of the road).

* Scaffolding in place everywhere - The goal is that even if all the in-game features are not yet enabled, all the OPTIONS will be visible (perhaps greyed out tho) so you can see where we're headed.

Where we are:
'bout 90% of this is already in place, and we keep turning new features on with each successive alpha build. I have no idea exactly how many will be "live" by the time we release....as many as we can arrange, to be sure, but most certainly not all of them. The scaffolding is nonetheless in place!

* Installation Routine

Where we are:
Not needed yet, but it'll be essential to have before we release the game. Right now, the game consists of an exe and two dll's. That's getting ready to change dramatically, with the addition of our graphics and sounds, and an installer program is a must-have (complete with some eye and ear candy while the game is installing). We have not even started on this, and it will prolly be one of the last bits we work on.

****

Things that will NOT be in the Beta

* Spells may or may not have graphics and sounds. We're getting to them as we can, but it's not a mammoth priority for us. A coolio (and ultimately necessary) addition, but not one that the game can't be played without.

* Windows and menus may or may not be finished. See above....we're looking for player input here!

* Alternate music tracks (see above...cool, but expensive....we'll add them after more critical things are done)

* Victory screens, fanfare, virtual attaboys for success in-game - see above - we want player input on this as well!

* MP - Not yet, but as I understand it, the "hooks" are in place to support it, and CB has good potential for MP, since the world size is somewhat compressed, compared to Civ, for example.

So, the question....how does this strike you? What else would you like to see up and running for the initial Beta Release?

-=Vel=-

DeepO · January 28, 2003, 13:18

Sounds good, Vel!

Oh, damn... I already knew this

DeepO

Velociryx · January 28, 2003, 13:32

Yeppers! And I'm tasking you with the not-inconsiderable job of makin' sure I don't forget anything!

-=Vel=-

DeepO · January 28, 2003, 14:09

Damn... seems like I volunteered for a task again

will do, Vel, as much as I find the time.

DeepO

Velociryx · January 28, 2003, 15:00

No worries bud....we'll get there....every day we prove that....

-=Vel=-

jdd2007 · January 28, 2003, 17:18

lookin good!

how moddable will it be? im just curious, not a real modder or anything.

Velociryx · January 28, 2003, 17:33

Hey bud! Yep...we're getting closer!

Moddability: The Beta will not be moddable at all, but that is something we have been designing for since day one, so eventually, nearly every aspect of the game will be modable in some form, and this, of course, will necessitate the presence of an editor.

Just don't look for it in the Beta!

-=Vel=-

BigRich · January 29, 2003, 08:59

Looking good, looking good!

One small suggestion Vel - could you sticky this thread, because it would go well with the Alpha News thread. One thread to show what we're aiming for with the Beta and to provide a place for discussion posts, the other to show how far along the road to the Beta we are and to put out more technical information if need be.

cheers,

Rich

Velociryx · January 29, 2003, 10:04

An excellent idea! Doing it right now!

-=Vel=-

alva · February 22, 2003, 23:34

Quote:

Originally posted by Velociryx

Moddability: The Beta will not be moddable at all, but that is something we have been designing for since day one, so eventually, nearly every aspect of the game will be modable in some form, and this, of course, will necessitate the presence of an editor.

Just don't look for it in the Beta!

-=Vel=-

Lazy buggers

A manual would be nice too

I'm not talking 'bout an on-line one, an PDF one will do

Other than that sounds

Cyclotron · February 24, 2003, 13:55

Quote:

Originally posted by alva
Lazy buggers

Yeah, well...

Quote:

A manual would be nice too

I'm not talking 'bout an on-line one, an PDF one will do

That's in the works, I believe. I'm working on a bit of backstory for it, and the technical stuff is being put together...

oberstein · February 25, 2003, 12:57

Just gets better and better! Thanks for taking the time to post the updates here, the whole concept is fascinating. It's impressive that you've kept cohesion through 12 months+

Presumably you do actually find some time to cope with the real world ^_^

SpencerH · February 28, 2003, 13:18

Glad to see things are still going .

SpencerH · February 28, 2003, 13:19

DP

Alex · March 20, 2003, 12:43

Wow, I had no idea that the game was in such advanced state of completion... Cool!

BustaMike · March 20, 2003, 16:30

Depends on your definition of advanced

, but it's definately comin' along.

pg · March 21, 2003, 00:44

vel - couldn't you guys use music already in the public domain? i'm pretty sure all the music in eu2 is like this and it's better than 95% of other game's music. there must be a pretty large selection available for free usage but it might be hard to find it.

SithUK · March 24, 2003, 07:48

Is the Beta due for release in 2003?

So far it looks very nice.

What about the AI? Will it be good?

Sith

beno · March 24, 2003, 12:20

So, when can we expect the mac 'port?

Velociryx · March 24, 2003, 15:10

Music - we coulda gone with public domain, but I was unable to find any good sources for high quality public domain music files that had the right "feel"

I did, however, find tons of commercial sites, so I went the path of least resistance....

As to the release....since we're running out of 1st Quarter 2003 pretty rapidly, I guess it's no secret that we'll probably not be making that self-established deadline.

How much will we miss it by? I have no idea.

In some respects, we're much further along than I had envisioned us as being, but the various pieces and parts are not yet fully assembled, and until they become so, the game is not cohesive enough to present.

But we're working on it....

-=Vel=-

SithUK · March 24, 2003, 15:22

Thanks for the update Vel. You mentioned an original goal of Q1 2003. I take it that you plan to have a first public release sometime in 2003?

Will there be a rudimentary AI in the first beta test release?

Sith

FrustratedPoet · March 24, 2003, 18:06

SithUK: Yeah, before Christmas last year we were hoping to release the Beta by the end of March 2003, but we're going to miss that date. It wouldn't make much sense for us to set another deadline, but I think we all expect it to be out before the end of the year.

It's great to see so much interest in the project still.

FrustratedPoet · March 24, 2003, 18:10

About the AI: Yes, there is already a rudimentary AI in the Alpha versions of the game that the team have been playing. I don't know how well it would hold up to a whole forum of people scheming ways to defeat it, but it certainly gives the player something to worry about at the moment.

Like every other area of the game the AI is something we'll be looking to change and improve following comments from players during Beta testing.

Velociryx · March 25, 2003, 10:57

Yep....what he said....

-=Vel=-

BigRich · March 25, 2003, 11:19

Quote:

It's great to see so much interest in the project still.

Amen to that!

Not knowing much about the programming side of things, my gut feeling is that AI development goes hand in hand with feature development. At the moment there's a couple of things still to add in, so the AI is necessarily limited.

On the bright side the AI factions are ready and willing to fight amongst themselves which I find very encouraging. No 'player against the entire world' game this one!

Rich.

Zealot · April 6, 2003, 18:07

Just to say that I do expect a great ending, because one of the things that frustrates me more about TBS games is that when I reach the end of the game victorious the "one more turn" addiction is still there and there is nothing for me to feed it with.

A timeline a la Civ 1-3 is not bad, but I'd like to see something more... entertaining.

Velociryx · April 7, 2003, 11:07

I know exactly what you mean, Zealot! The ending (and specifically, having an ending that's worthy of the struggle to get there) ranks really high up there on the list of important things to attend to!

Right now, we have no particular ending built on, and that is by design. What we're hoping for is that, when we release the game for the open beta, we'll get a good body of interested players built up, and their thoughts, opinions and observations will be instrumental in shaping the ending....

-=Vel=-

SpencerH · April 27, 2003, 10:18

I havent seen any mention of PC specs/OS etc.

BigRich · April 28, 2003, 04:14

Quote:

Originally posted by SpencerH
I havent seen any mention of PC specs/OS etc.

Please bear in mind that this applies to old Alpha builds only

Version 18 worked quite happily on my K6 300, 92MB RAM, clunky graphics and sound, running Windows 95. I suspect Version 19 would be just as happy on that setup but it also runs on my new (distinctly higher powered

) machine running XP Home.

Things have moved on a bit since then but I'm guessing that it will run on most PCs. As for Mac OS, Linux etc...... if anyone wants to do a port then take it up with Vel

Rich.

SpencerH · April 28, 2003, 07:01

Sounds great, but thats without the eye candy eh?