missplaced priorties with this shuttel thing.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 15:31

I am not shocked by this tragic event that has occured over the skys of my home state.
Not the first won't be the last.
what I find disturbing is the fact that these parent atronughts were so rapped up in there personal gratifcation that they were not thinking about there children.
What parent would ride a rocket to the sky with small children at home.
These parents who put there own intrest before there children get no symapthy from me.
Most of you will have no idea what Im trying to say unless you have children of your own.
Any loss of life is tragic. These parent astroNAUGHTS knew the risk and still put themselves before there children.
Oh well, this is how I feel.

Doc

I don't want to argue this

Solver · February 2, 2003, 15:37

Any parent that flies a plane is a butt, for the plane might crash. Any parent who drives a car is a butt, for he might crash.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 15:40

The Mad Monk · February 2, 2003, 15:43

Sorry Doc, can't agree with you.

Surely you wouldn't say the same about career military with family?

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 15:48

Well, Im not looking for anyone who has no children to understand.

I would just expect that as dangerous as these missions to the stars can be that they would require them to be single, childless, adults.

This is how I feel.

Looks to much like selfishness to me.

I don't expect any you young folk to understand or you selfish ones to understand.

Not trolling this is how I feel.

Wernazuma III · February 2, 2003, 15:49

IMHO, it's irresponsible to choose an extremely risky job when you have a family, also a career in the military. And being an astronaut IS extremely dangerous and they knew it

But anyway, I don't really get the huge shock about this tragic accident. Come on, it HAD to happen at some time again. I actually already wondered, why nothing was happening for so long. And hey, when a plane crashes, generally many more people die. Now, you wouldn't hear me lamenting about this in the presence of the victims' families, but I don't see the national tragedy - spacefaring is a risky thing, accidents happen. Period.

Solver · February 2, 2003, 15:52

And actually the chances of a soldier in a dangerous area to die are even higher than the chances of astronauts to die, oftentimes.

And those people are heroes because they venture off in space exploration. They knew perfectly well of the dangers, they were sarcificing themselves for the humanity.

While it might be irresponsible to get a risky job with a family, there's just too much risks in life. Extreme sports, military, some parts of medicine, they're all risky. Just as driving a car to work every day is.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 15:52

Quote:

it's irresponsible to choose an extremely risky job when you have a family

Wernazuma III

Thanks

You say it better than my dumb azz ever could

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 15:56

A soldier will give there life to protect the country and the people.

What did these HEROS give besides there own lives?

and offspring with one parent?

Solver · February 2, 2003, 16:03

As I posted a few times, I hate military service, in all forms and kinds thereof. It's surely great to have an army, but any military service sucks big time.

I believe that people who bring something to science are worth MUCH MUCH more than some soldiers.

Kramerman · February 2, 2003, 16:03

Quote:

Originally posted by Docfeelgood
Well, Im not looking for anyone who has no children to understand.

I would just expect that as dangerous as these missions to the stars can be that they would require them to be single, childless, adults.

This is how I feel.

Looks to much like selfishness to me.

I don't expect any you young folk to understand or you selfish ones to understand.

Not trolling this is how I feel.

What, so parents aren't ever supposed to take risks? They can never try to escape North Korea to the Japanese embassy in China, so that there children may have a better life? They can never immigrate from their lowly livelyhoods in their old countries to more developed nations for the same reason?

Quote:

Any parent that flies a plane is a butt, for the plane might crash. Any parent who drives a car is a butt, for he might crash.

really, come on. Are you suggesting no matter how good someone is for the job (of astronaught), if they had children and were good parents, they would have to decline because of the risk involved?

If i were the child of one of those astronaughts, i would be no doubt very sad now, but I would also be proud, both before this tragedy occured, and after. Id be proud because my parent was an astronaught, exploring the frontier of science, pushing back the boundries, going into space and doing what millions dream to do.

Kman

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:07

Well,you want a hero father/mother
or
would you want a live father/mother?

Ask them.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:08

"Hero ain't nuttin but a sandwich"

Wernazuma III · February 2, 2003, 16:09

Quote:

Originally posted by Solver
While it might be irresponsible to get a risky job with a family, there's just too much risks in life. Extreme sports, military, some parts of medicine, they're all risky. Just as driving a car to work every day is.

Well, a man with a family who risks his life in a very dangerous sport and who got a family acts irresponsible too. The example with the car is invalid though. Many people are simply BOUND to use the car if they wish to earn money to feed their families.
Like I think it's irresponsible to make a career in the army while having family you can't blame someone who got conscripted - you can't choose.

Datajack Franit · February 2, 2003, 16:09

Doc

Why is everybody so stupid! The world is filled with morons spreading their idiot opinions all over the world!

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:11

Quote:

Why is everybody so stupid! The world is filled with morons spreading their idiot opinions all over the world!

but...but...

I did not call you stupid!

Solver · February 2, 2003, 16:11

At least if my father died while exploring space, I could have been proud of him. If he died during some military operation, I wouldn't have been nearly as proud.

And yes, I agree that a live parent is always preferrable, but as others have well said, everything is risky. You're then saying that parents can take no risks.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:14

Only a selfish, irrispossable parent would put themselvs first

Solver · February 2, 2003, 16:21

A selfish person would never want to die anyway, trying to do anything possible to avoid death.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:24

Quote:

A selfish person would never want to die anyway, trying to do anything possible to avoid death.

These people were riding a rocket!

Ming · February 2, 2003, 16:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Docfeelgood
I don't expect any you young folk to understand or you selfish ones to understand.

I'm not young... I have children... and I'm not selfish, and I think you are totally wrong

Solver · February 2, 2003, 16:32

See, Ming sees the point perfectly

.

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:36

Quote:

I'm not young... I have children... and I'm not selfish, and I think you are totally wrong

Thats ok, you can disagree, its America!

seriousely,I as a parent would never put my own ambitions before my children.

How can one have children knowing they may not see them finish the six grade because they choose to ride rockets?

Wanna ride rockests, don't have children to orphan.

Velociryx · February 2, 2003, 16:43

Ahhh, but the car example is perfectly valid.

The FACT is, it ain't a safe world. I can't think of a single job that doesn't carry some risk, and from what you're saying, when a person becomes a PARENT, weighing the risk, and *always* coming down on the side of caution is the only answer.

So....the WTC should have been empty when the planes hit. After all, many of those folks were, no doubt, parents, and they should not have been so thoughtless.....they should have thought about the possibility.

In the same vein, NO PARENT should ever drive a car.

Too risky.

Which of course, means that no parent ought to work....given the possible risks inherent in transporting oneself to and from the workplace (which is, no matter what you do, filled up with dangers, both seen and unseen), this is simply something that parents cannot afford to do.

Of course, you see what happens when you follow the argument to its "logical" conclusion, yes?

-=Vel=-

Solver · February 2, 2003, 16:44

Doc, do you ever drive a car? Don't you feel that you might get into a car accident and never see your children again?

Solver · February 2, 2003, 16:45

Oh, Vel has just made my point, he said what I wanted to, but was too lazy to type.

BTW, Master Vel, a great pleasure to see you addicted to Apolyton OTF

.

Zero · February 2, 2003, 16:46

As I heard 3 different announcers on news/radio said something to the ffect of "just when you expected shuttle flying to be routine operation...", yeah riding rocket is a dangerous task that may go wrong in so many aspects, but people become accustomed to routines if nothign seems to go wrong in such a streak. Which is why I questioned the courage part before. I certainly would have signed up if I could to fly to space completely ignoring the risks.

Which is why I'd disagree with you, Doc. The thought of not returning to see their kids probably didnt register much. Its not exaclt the same as flying a plane, but who really does think of their flight being the last one? If so, its most likely because of recent tragedy that reminds you something CAN go wrong.

Velociryx · February 2, 2003, 16:48

Dang it, Solver.....I've been *trying* to stay away.....but OT is like a giant vacuum....once you get curious enough to take a peek, it sucks you in!

I've had a browser window open all day, while working on Candle'Bre stuff in Photoshop....guess which one I've been devoting more time to!?

-=Vel=-
(and thank ya for the welcome! I alwasy enjoy my forrays into the OT, even if this one has been tinged with tragedy....)

Docfeelgood · February 2, 2003, 16:50

I like you guys and I am not trying to belittle you,
so, bear with me, you guys know I have a hard time communicating my thoughts

I don't think you understand what I am tring to say.

Everything in life is a chance if getting you killed.
So why increase your chances of getting killed?

I don't think I can explain this one

Zero · February 2, 2003, 16:53

I think I explained it VERY well. People get accustomed to routine procedures. Which is where errors can occur mostly. When things become routine, there is rarely no courage and risk to consider.

I dont blame them for not having to love their kids and choosing their ambition over children, nor am I calling them a coward. All I am saying is that they probably didnt get enough whiff of reality because of illusion routine procedure that everything may go alright. (Seriously which would have been more of a shocker news? shuttle lands safely or shuttle crashes?) Whether they are brave or career-minded over their kids remains to be tested. Current situation does not really reveal much about neither.

I couldn't help but bring this courage part again because same people who were arguing agst me is belittling the risk factor by saying that everything has a risk. I should have kept silent but if your gonna flame me go ahead. I'll shut up now.