The art of leaving cities undefended - Page 3

StrategicKingMi · February 27, 2003, 15:46

Because of the limitations of 1 x 1 deity, there is less exploration, less expansion thus less huts. less units to take free citys from other civs.
So bad huts and good huts for other player, most games are lost this way, despite people playing on endlessly, its decided before any wonders or government change is made.
In 2 x 2 king, you have more units to get at thoose free citys, more exploration which is more huts and this means a better chance of hut luck falling even.
Furthermore, each hut is less then half the value of what it is in 1 prod.
Also, on 2 x 2 , if your orginal starting position sucks, you can move to a better location almost 3 times faster then under 1 move (considering the fact if you have one horse early from a hut, it can move its last movement onto a forest or hill 50% of the time)
So land and huts decide by far greater number of games then any government change or wonders.
Give me good huts and good land and you build whatever wonder ypu want and ill win on 1 x 1 deity most of the time.
(not to mention if you start on a river and other guy does not, this is a HUGE game ending advantage since it takes two turns to road and you can build a city on that river and get an extra trade for that spot thus doubling your trade production for that square)

DrSpike · February 27, 2003, 16:09

There was a really good thread a while back about the affect hut luck has on different settings.......if I can find it I'll bump it.

jes · February 27, 2003, 18:51

my english is so bad, so ill write in german, maybe someone can translate, sorry:

na klasse, das war's also mit dem großen spiel gegen eyes. zufällig trafen wir uns heute abend (durch vermittlung von atawa). ok, hin und her-geplänkel, gibts nun inseln oder nicht, letzlich läßt sich eyes auf inseln ein. er darf also hg bauen, wunderbar. ich hab blödes land zu beginn, aber finde einen reiter, der findet noch andere einheiten und ein dorf.

. wie schön. dann ein schiffchen gebaut, reiter und chariot drauf und los. zwischendurch wirds immer etwas schwierig, weil eyes mich vollsabbelt, beschimpft, lächerlich macht usw. be cool, jes, gaaaaaaaaaaanz ruhig, es ist doch ein spiel. schließlich findet mein schiffchen eine insel - und eine städtchen von eyes. oha. stadt kaputt, eyes gibt auf. "hab ich's doch gesagt..." ok, sag ich, das war nur glück, kein skill. "willst du etwa sagenm, das war skill???" nein, hab ich doch gerade geasgt arghh.
na gut, neues spiel, mit eyes settinges, weil meine waren ja blöde, anfängerhaft usw.

guterstart, fluss in der nähe usw. reiter gebaut. oha, eine stadt von eyes in der nähe??!! reiter kaputt. na toll. neuer reiter, die stadt muss doch kaputt zu kriegen sein. fehlrer gemacht, reiter kaputt. mist. eyes muss mit tonnen von einheiten kommen. ich geb auf. na klasse.

"ich habs doch gesagt, du hast keine ahnung, alles anfänger, was schlag ich mich überhaupt mit anfängern rum, alles ist einfach in diety, kampf, aufbau, alles. und nun hau ab, du blöder rookie."

ok, die beschimpfungen haben für den rest der woche gereicht. leider konnte ich eyes keine lektion erteilen, wie findig man in 1x1x diety spielen kann. schade.

DrSpike · February 27, 2003, 19:57

I just about got that. Quick summary:

They played 1x1x deity, with Eyes allowed to build HG. Jes won.

They played Eyes' settings and Eyes won.

Eyes still thinks deity is for rookies.

atawa · February 27, 2003, 20:44

Yeah, that about sums it up.

So Eyes lost on Deity through an invasion by Jes before HG.

Shouldnt leave these city's undefended I guess

DrSpike · February 27, 2003, 21:55

Hehe old habits die hard I guess.

jes · February 28, 2003, 03:44

hi, thanks for you summaries. yesterday i was angry and frustrated, then i cant express myself in other languages. in germany we have great games and i wanted to show eyes how to attack cities in diety. hmmpf, now there nothing but wasted time. well, i think its better to play you and have fun

Hydey · February 28, 2003, 05:52

Quote:

Originally posted by DrSpike

They played 1x1x deity, with Eyes allowed to build HG. Jes won.

Eyes still thinks deity is for rookies.

The master must have suffered extreme bad luck and he had a virus with a high temperature so this game obviously does not count as a loss.

The master is still unbeaten in all civ games at all levels on all settings

Cobra · February 28, 2003, 09:13

Quote:

Originally posted by Hydey

The master is still unbeaten in all civ games at all levels on all settings

Wasn´t his first nick "liesatnight"?

rah · February 28, 2003, 12:16

Quote:

Originally posted by HappySunShine
You guys keep saying this isn't a viable strategy, it's only not a viable strategy when you are forced to defend your cities due to martial law.

Back to the point though. Having the instinct to know where to defend and to know where to find someone who isn't defending is part of what makes me so great. I can go games completely without any units in my cities and without losing a single city because I have the instinct and the knowledge to do that.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist.

RAH

DrSpike · February 28, 2003, 12:19

Hehe that was underhand.

Funny though.

Ming · February 28, 2003, 12:23

Cyrion · February 28, 2003, 12:31

Quote:

Originally posted by HappySunShine
I can go games completely without any units in my cities and without losing a single city because I have the instinct and the knowledge to do that.

If I ever get a second computer, I might name it "instinct and knowledge"...

rah · February 28, 2003, 12:40

And it does raise another point. He claimed in 1x1x deity that there is no strategy/choice because you're forced to defend you cities for martial law. It seems, that is not the case. Even in 1x1x deity you CAN choose not to defend your cities.

RAH

War4ever · February 28, 2003, 16:41

you gotta love it when it comes around and *smack* hits you right in the cakehole

i am sure eyes was talking purely in jest when he said he wouldn't lose a single city hahahhaa

MalevolentLight · February 28, 2003, 16:46

It's unfortunate jes doesn't speak English, but then again it's probably for the best. THe first game was on little tiny islands which is a bullshit setting in the first place and on deity it's even worse. He landed on my city of York with a chariot and a horseman, I had no way of stopping him with the techs I had. It's on deity you stupid ****, I have no choice but to defend. I hate stupid people. I can't put into words how much I hate them. The second game I won, even though jes had ****ing whales and **** and I had a forest and grassland. But that's because jes can't do **** unless he's given a few thousand years to grow, and he said as much himself. The second game was deity 1x1x also on a medium map, it's just too bad jes doesn't know how to fight very well. The only reason jes won the first game was because we were right next to each other, I was about 5 spaces from him and he landed me which is impossible to stop with units he got out of huts. I got 1 unit out of a hut and it was an archer too far away. Really, amazing games. I can see how there is so much strategy involved, I really do.

jes · February 28, 2003, 17:08

eyes, if you would take your time to play me and not to blame me, we could have good games. but all the time you talk about **** and rookie-settings and so on, so i have no fun in playing you.

its a fact your argumenats are poor, all the things you said about our games are the same you can critisize in a 2x2x game.
about the startings places, you whined about, i put one in the attachement. did i say a word? i played, and i had luck, ok, but i hate people, talking all the time, but not playing and taking a good challenge.

in the save, eyes is the greek, me babys.

atawa · February 28, 2003, 20:27

Quote:

Originally posted by MalevolentLight
*Whine*

Dont know if I have to put

or

here.........

War4ever · February 28, 2003, 20:40

Sean is an idiot, his excuse is luck cuz he lost

but had his units found Jes it would have been skill

and as for his win , its all skill of course...

gotta love it

MalevolentLight · February 28, 2003, 22:28

Actually My units never found jes. Jes gave up when he failed to kill my city. It's not my fault he's stupid and isn't aware that attacking a fortified warrior on a river with a horseman will result in the horseman losing. The only reason jes won the first game was that I got that chariot out of a hut, and were were very close together on an island map. I had no way of stopping him from landing me and killing my city. The game was over as soon as he got that chariot. None of you have been able to present a good strategy used on deity, while I on the other hand can name 20 different and unique strategies to be used on King. The first game was an islands games, the second was all one continent. Jes admitted in the beginning that he was trying to even the game by making it islands. Less land means less exploration and less options for expansion. Lesser players take away options from the better player in an attempt to even the game. It's that way in all games. It's why rookies in AOC play blackforest because it's so easy to wall and forces all players to boom to imperial age. It's why the WCG is played on Arabia because it allows for all forms of play.

deity · February 28, 2003, 22:51

There seem to be quite a few good 1x1x players posting here, especially from Europe and UK.

Any chance of finding a timeslot that will work for Aussies and Europe?

Suggest a 1x1x deity level ongoing game with 5 players - any other settings.

StrategicKingMi · February 28, 2003, 23:30

I believe 1 x 1 players about the laziest civ players ever. And I am prepared, as boring and horrible as it will be to prove it. To proof once and for all that I am the best player in the world, bar none, at any settings.
So I suggest a 1 x 1 deity game under the following conditions to remove luck from deciding the victor:
1) no huts
2) premade, island board with civs seperated, can be a random board where the civs are placed in equal, yet poss. different locations. or a random start that is aproved by both players, no city construction or irrigation or roading for a number of turns to determine that starts for both are acceptable thus maintaining the unkown board, only problem is the games desire to place civs very close, which ultimately will lead to an unsatisfying and inconclusive finish.
3) save the start, and replay that board with players switching starting civs.
This will lead to a conclusive finish. You win, your better, end of story.

deity · March 1, 2003, 01:46

Strat, you talking about the duel challenge there?

The game I was suggesting is MP = 5 players, yes?

Cobra · March 1, 2003, 05:16

Quote:

Originally posted by StrategicKingMi
So I suggest a 1 x 1 deity game under the following conditions to remove luck from deciding the victor:
1) no huts
2) premade, island board with civs seperated...
3) save the start, and replay that board with players switching starting civs.
This will lead to a conclusive finish. You win, your better, end of story.

that´s it.

DrSpike · March 1, 2003, 09:29

Interesting suggestion strat, but you may as well use premade boards if you are going to play like this, or just play once only per random board, since in the return match both players will know the map.