Dev Planning - Without the spam.

AceQ · March 7, 2003, 16:21

What I'm looking for is a set of ideas people have used for Development Planning. I really don't care if you like or dislike them. I simply want to know what some basic plans are.

I've found the more I try and manipulate the plan, the more micro I end up doing. Knowing this, I re-read the manual and noticed many of the plans only had one segment filled. I tried it and ended up with an AI that I really enjoyed from Turn 10 onward.

Please Note: I play multiplayer most of the time. Three or Four Humans players is so radically different, I can't begin to discuss it here.

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Here is my base plan, I'll drop info in on key pieces.

All Planets
Primary: Infrastructure - I wanted to ensure my AI started to develop the planet before trying anything else.
Secondary: *Blank* - I wanted my other rules to gauge the secondary action.
Tertiary: Govt - This may seem odd to some, but I need a Govt building on just about all of my planets, so it makes a good fit here.

In a game with mass expansion a must, you need to set some others...

Core Planets
Primary: *blank* - Blank!? Yep, because your core planets are going to become large in number, you don't want to set a primary goal here. You can use other measures to get the primary goal completed.
Secondary: Moral - Keep the people happy and more productive at your core worlds.
Tertiary: Planetary Defense - What the? This is an odd choice but early game, you may only have 6-10 stars. Of those, your 'Core' Planets need defense because the Human players don't sit on there hands. They come hard and straight for... yep, your core planets.

Mineral Rich (now we are getting somewhere)
Primary: Mine
Secondary: Mine
Tertiary: *Blank* - this last one is important. Your AI instructions are going to need the room for the 'ring' instructions.

I like this basic model because we left a few blanks above and within to secure holes or allow for a bit more flexibility without micro.

Mineral Poor
Primary: *Blank* - Yep, Blank again. Because I want to make sure the 'ring' and All Planets gets applied first.
Secondary: Manufacture
Tertiary: Manufacture - after the primary things have been accomplished, go for the Manufacture.

Green Ring (Farms Anyone?)
Primary: Farms
Secondary: *Blank*
Tertiary: Research
Green is tough because you can find many great planets of various sizes and mineral abundance. By putting a certain amount of research into the mix, you are going to ensure the planets that you are farming / quickly populating are kicking in a share of the knowledge for the empire.

If you find a Green Rich planet, it may be a bit of an all in one planet. Since I love to specialize and allow the import to fulfill the majority, this is a touch planet. It would be ‘All Planets, Green, Rich, and perhaps Secondary / Core’ right away depending on how you colonized it and with what amount of ships. So Infrastructure, Mining and Farms would be fighting for the top spot. In the end though, this planet would be an efficient way to create a solid generalized world.

I really don't assign much more than this in the intro. Obviously this is just a basic template that I've done well with. Some games I need a new and Secondary plan but most of the time the general classifications do the trick. The key is to not overload your AI. Keep as many blanks in the mix as possible without losing your focus. Yellow and Red planets are very tough as they have a wide range of uses. I generally make a few player based plans for those and if I'm going to make a general plan, I ensure Terraforming is in the tertiary slot.

Yellow Ring
Primary: *Blank*
Secondary: *Blank*
Tertiary: *Terraforming

The idea here is to let the ‘All Planets’ and Mineral Status give you the planet you need until you can Terraform it into a better planet. I may also Player Define a Primary or Secondary just for one off planets or Magnate Civs.

Others include Starvation / Unrest and those are rare occasions as the plan seems to keep the populous pretty happy. The research curve is just a bit slow for most races and you may find yourself adding research to things like sweet spot and a few others to keep it humming along. I've not tested this out against the computer AI much as they play so much differently, the plan would have to be modified for a much less aggressive style.

What glaring omission is apparent? Trade. The race you play will make Trade spark a secondary or tertiary spot in one or more of the development plans. I generally play a pretty aggressive game and thin my stars quite quickly. If you put a good plan in place after your 5th or 6th star, you can auto-settle the rest without worries.

I hope this starts a thread of discussion; I would love to see what others have come up with.

Xlr8 · March 7, 2003, 18:07

Well, it looks cool to me, but i havent even created one yet so... but looks good!

vmxa1 · March 7, 2003, 18:56

Yes that is whayt I was looking for, what are people doing and why.
I still am not sure about why I should choose Morale over Rec or even Mil. They all seem to help with unrest as does Gov.
So many of the things you may elect to use are going to be the same in most peoples eyes, but some are more eqivacal and I do not have enough data to pick one over the other yet.

sloejack · March 7, 2003, 19:55

Take a look at this thread, it has a lot of good information as well.

http://www.ina-community.com/forums/...hreadid=271212

AceQ · March 7, 2003, 23:09

Yeah, I've seen that thread. I found that filling all the blanks like that guy did is a bit more confusing but ends up with the same results. I try to use the least amount of plans to make easier calculations. I've also found that putting something in each blank tends to specialize the planet types and forces you to severely manipulate your Dev Plan per race and strategy. That thread is what got me thinking about the Dev Plan though and it explains what I believe is going on very well.

Overall I think the viceroy plays to much like the computer and not enough like a 'human player.' Hopefully we can all come up with a few general Dev Plans to help get the viceroys into shape.

-AceQ-

Hokiemon · March 8, 2003, 10:33

AceQ - I've been trying your Dev Plans in a single player game, and they seem to work pretty good so far, so thanks for the idea! I did try a Dev plan for New planets with Planetary Defense set has Primary, and when I check back on a new planet several turns later, it had 10 Military DEA's, no Bioharvest DEA's, and very few Mining or Industry DEA's. What a mess!

All - Does anybody know how the AI determines the planet classifications and what criteria it used to change the classification? For example, what causes the classification to change from New to Secondary? Population growth? Also, why can't I change the AI assigned classification to something other than user defined? I had a mineral poor planet the the AI classified and Secondary and Large, and couldn't change it to Mineral Poor.

Asmodean · March 8, 2003, 13:47

I'm looking for an answer for Hokiemon's question too.

Asmodean

notyoueither · March 8, 2003, 14:57

I'm not happy with the results of any of the Dev plans I have tried, including that posted here and those suggested elsewhere. The only problem is that I notice that if I assign the DEA's manually after colonization they don't all get built, unlike those done by the governors (which I can edit). So, I can decide each and every DEA myself, but I have to micro manage the planet everytime a DEA is completed to check and edit what the governor ques next and they all get built. Or I can set all DEAs on settlement (preferred) but not all of them get built anytime soon.

Does anyone know how to get around that?

asleepathewheel · March 8, 2003, 16:54

Some of my questions have to do with what exactly constitutes the different dev categories.

for example, its obvious what farm and mine and manufacture and research and recreation and terraforming does, but what about the others?

Infrastructure: what does this aid? I haven't seen where this is tallied, perhaps I am overlooking it. How does prioritizing this help me? increase pps? increase something? what

military-helps with unrest yes. does it do anything else? I think that a military dea should be required to form ground troops but thats me.

trade- does that just build spaceports in the deas? anything else?

I'm sure there are others that i'm overlooking that are ambiguous, as I am away for the weekend from the game and can't check.

AceQ · March 8, 2003, 22:52

Hokiemon - From what I've read it only shows you two classifications but applies up to five. So a Mineral Poor Planet will still have your plan apply. You can check 3 turns after it's colonized to see if any manufacturing DEA's are being built. ( if that’s a primary )

notyoueither - Most of the people who can't find any Dev plan to work usually don't have a firm grasp on the viceroy. The Viceroy fights against you and goes against the Dev Plan for the needs of the people. So if you put 'Mine' in every area... it will still build farms to feed the masses. Also you may have a very specific strategy in mind that doesn't play well with the viceroys. What are some of the plans you have tried?

All - Is anyone else willing to post a Dev Plan? I can't be the only guy online with a dev plan to share.

vmxa1 · March 9, 2003, 00:01

AceQ I use many, some are not static as I will redo them from time to time. These are the ones I am using to force in a specific dea.
I have not use this in awhile, but I was getting lots of red planets from the AI and starvation so I made a Player1 with just Farm. I slapped it in both slots to override it normal use. Things like that.
I am messing around with this one now:
ALL - infra terra gov
SEC - mine farm def
Green - farm blank research
New - farm manu morale
Rich - mine mine manu
I may need to alter this, but I wanted to check it out.

notyoueither · March 9, 2003, 07:22

Quote:

Originally posted by AceQ
notyoueither - Most of the people who can't find any Dev plan to work usually don't have a firm grasp on the viceroy. The Viceroy fights against you and goes against the Dev Plan for the needs of the people. So if you put 'Mine' in every area... it will still build farms to feed the masses. Also you may have a very specific strategy in mind that doesn't play well with the viceroys. What are some of the plans you have tried?

I clicked through 100 turns with yours. Had three Recreation DEAs on one planet.

Like I said, I prefer to specify DEAs on each planet myself as I settle them. I think those are the best plans.

I have tried my own, and those of others. I always wind up with the VR building industry or gov in Rare Special Zones, or other stupid things.

Sorry, I feel that DEA planning is too important to leave to the AI. Call me a heretic.

Main_Brain · March 9, 2003, 09:41

Hive/Uni should switch Rec with Military.
I assume the Government is for this Planetary defnse thingie?

AceQ · March 9, 2003, 10:31

vmxa1 - I tried something very similar to what you have down and ended up putting in more blank areas to allow for diversity. Your plan looks good. I'll have to give it a shot and see if the differences between your plan and the one I was using to see if it makes a difference.

notyoueither - Yep, the Viceroy does some odd stuff no matter what plan you put in place. When playing multiplayer though, you just don't have the time ( 1-2min turns ) to get that gritty with the planets.

Fosse · March 10, 2003, 17:33

Quote:

Originally posted by AceQ
Green Ring (Farms Anyone?)
Primary: Farms
Secondary: *Blank*
Tertiary: Research

I was trying this, and all was going swimmingly until I checked on a Green 1 planet that was mineral rich, low biodiversity, arid soil everywhere, and had no plains... farms were being built everywhere.

I removed all plans from green ring planets, and only put terraforming in yellow and red rings. THen I put the farming priorities into the "Farm" category and the "high biodiversity" category... which I assume would give the right results... naturally I am guessing, as we all are.

vmxa1 · March 10, 2003, 18:00

AceQ I am always on the look out for any good ideas, so post anything you learn.

Hokiemon · March 11, 2003, 00:11

I've been trying these:

Mineral Rich - Mine/Manufacture/Mine
Mineral Poor - Research/Farm/Research

Hoping to get the rich planets building the starships, and the poor doing the science and farming.

Fosse · March 11, 2003, 02:29

Does anybody know with any degree of certaintly what ALL of the possible planet designations mean? And what the lines between the distinctions are?

I know what a Mineral RIch planet is... but what EXACTLY does the AI consider a Trade or Farm planet to be? I have guesses, but I want facts.

Also... Mineral rich, Mineral poor... what about all of those Mineral Average planets I have sitting around? I don't want another designation for them in the plans screen, but I do want to know if either of the current plans apply here, or some weird average of them....

I understand that this might be mystery that takes a while to solve... now I'm off to tweak my "secondary" planets... whatever that may mean...

Hokiemon · March 11, 2003, 23:10

Quote:

Originally posted by AceQ
Hokiemon - From what I've read it only shows you two classifications but applies up to five. So a Mineral Poor Planet will still have your plan apply. You can check 3 turns after it's colonized to see if any manufacturing DEA's are being built. ( if that’s a primary )

Up to five DEV Plans? No wonder the Viceroys are confused! So am I.

If true, how does this work? Are all plans given equal weighting? If a viceroy has to satisify up to five primary DEV Plans, will it ever get around to secondary and tertiary items? If they are not weighted equally, are the two DEV Plans displayed the top two priorities? Is the All Planets DEV Plan an overiding priority, or just a default plan in case nothing else is specified? So many questions, so few answers.