QS have released Patch info!

[The Templar]

It's been a month, anyone see that rumored patch yet? Rantz said two more years and he would have had the perfect game - does this mean 23 months to go for that patch?

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by ACEofHeart
Okie,,
I'll buy into the fact that an alien might not have an Arkansas accent or speak like an Oxford graduate..
The points I was trying to make is..
(A) Why would a species that intelligent and advanced talk like a 3rd grader. But I guess a diplomat learning English is much harder than Intergalactic travel .
(B) The constant repetitive and useless treaties, as they still will declare war for reasons unknown..

I didn't expect diplomacy as good as AC, but at least equal to MOO2...!!

On another note, will they patch "Intial starting points".
Why did they insist on clupming everyone together even in every large galaxy. It does not give you time to learn the basics and almost makes you build "obsolete" ships..

Alittle ot I remember the early computer like the commando 64 and some early apple and IBM computer have than save and replace command which will save your files to the same name as one of your girl and delete
the old one. Some computer magine writers kept saying it didnot work right on the C-64 . It worked correctly as it save the current file under than temp name and then delete the old name and then change the temp file name
back to the one you want. The writer said he got than out
of room on 5 1/4 inch disk, he load than 20 k text file work
on it untril it was 40 k long notice he only have 20 k of disk space left so he thought the save and replace command will delete the old filename first instead of saveing the new file under than temp name. What I than saying that the diplormat which you think is broken isnot really broken but working the way they want it to.

[Nirvana_CN]

Ahh well. Moo3 lost its chance to impress. Im hooked on Gal-Civ! I just sold my copy of Moo3 on Ebay for £18.

Maybe after moo3 has 3 or 4 patches i might pick up a cheap copy from the £10 bargin bin and see if it improves

[statusperfect]

BAH! The patch will be MASSIVE!

Don't throw away you copies yet. Moo3 will be new game after the patch.
Just remember Civ3!

[The Templar]

Originally posted by statusperfect
BAH! The patch will be MASSIVE!

It'll be massive alright. It will span 2 CDs, be called 'Master of Orion 4', come from a different developer, and retail for $49.99.

Don't throw away you copies yet. Moo3 will be new game after the patch.
Just remember Civ3!

Civ3 had one major flaw when it came out - air superiority/SAMs did not work. That was fixed after a week or two. Maybe Firaxis should do MoO4 ...

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by statusperfect
BAH! The patch will be MASSIVE!

Don't throw away you copies yet. Moo3 will be new game after the patch.
Just remember Civ3!

Not sure why I should presume they will do some magic in a massive patch, I hope so though.

There was not all that much wrong with Civ3 when it came out. Many improvements were made over time, but the game was fun day 1 for those who liked it.
I have not seen/heard that many saving Moo3 was fun.
Some people liked it, but they are not raving or anything. I played two games, found it hard to continue and await improvements.
IOW Moo3 is no where near as enjoyable as Civ3 was on day 1.

[statusperfect]

I think Moo3 is exciting but flawed. I was hooked from day one.

The interface sucks though. Many people who complain about flaws just don't understand the interface. *.pdf manual is on the way.

[Triphosphatase]

The Air superiority/SAMs bug disgusted me. It was not possible to play an entire game without running into this glaring and game-wreaking bug, so I have to wonder what Firaxis was doing to playtest Civ3.

Were they trying to insult us? Sure insulted me. Never will buy a game from them again.

[CharlesBHoff]

DO I HAVE TO REMAIN PEOPLE THAT NO GAME RELEASE TODAY IS BUG FREE ANYMORE. IN THE LATE 1970'S AND EARLY 1980's GAMES WHERE RELEASE BUG FREE AS THEY WHERE SIMPLER AND THERE WAS NO MILLION'S OF DIFFERENT HARDWARE COMBINAION'S TO WORRY GAME PROGRAMERS.

[statusperfect]

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff
DO I HAVE TO REMAIN PEOPLE THAT NO GAME RELEASE TODAY IS BUG FREE ANYMORE. IN THE LATE 1970'S AND EARLY 1980's GAMES WHERE RELEASE BUG FREE AS THEY WHERE SIMPLER AND THERE WAS NO MILLION'S OF DIFFERENT HARDWARE COMBINAION'S TO WORRY GAME PROGRAMERS.

The bugs isn't the problem. The layout of the game itself is the problem.

[Harry Seldon]

Anyone heard about the patch again? I just want to make sure I get it before it disappears forever.

[Kloreep]

Some new changes:

Improved behavior under alt-tab. Application normally will auto-refresh now.

Modified migration code so that Harvesters will prefer planets with edible population (similar to the behavior everyone seems to think they already have).

Modified Splinter Colony/Magnate Civ code so that splinter colony will only occur if hab zone is as good as any magnate. So, if it would be Green for a splinter, but is Sweet Spot for a Magnate, the Magnate will now get the planet (previously it would have been a splinter). This should make all Magnates available for all Species, although they will still not get the same distribution.

Added Sitrep filters for Construction, Military Construction and Espionage.


Added Sitrep when senate bill is seconded and available to vote (data only change)

All of the main UI tabs now remember the last sub-panel and return there.

Modified the ground combat tech capture (added earlier in the patch) to be a chance based on the univalue of the planet AFTER ground combat completes. There may still be some balancing tweaks here.

Well, even if macromanagement isn't getting any easier, the sitrep change will at least make micromanaging easier...

Also, it looks like there's a tentative release date for the data patch:

Due to a fair number of people reporting severe stability problems that we cannot recreate, including a number that have fixed them by reinstalling or identifying short mob files, we have developed a install validation utility which is now available at moo3.quicksilver.com/downloads/Moo3InstallCheck.zip.

This program will also handle the "data patch", which is being sent to Beta testers this evening and expected to be released to the public the middle of next week.

All code patches have to go through Infogrames QA, so we are bundling changes together. There are still some military AI issues and diplomacy issues we need to address before we are ready to release it to QA. The UI changes being made are not impacting this work, since it is different programmers. We will send the code patch to QA no later than the end of the current month (April).

So, data patch in a week or two, and maybe code patch to follow a week or two later.

[habadacus]

Hey Guys!

Yo, I just checked out the official MOO3 site, and get this ... THE GAME HAS GONE GOLD!!! YEE-HAH! Finally the wait is over!!!

Meanwhile just to compare how other companies do buisness there was a post on the GalCiv forum time stamped 4/5/2003 12:44:31 AM that V1.02 has been released. Of course these patches aren't huge efforts, because that game went out the door in good working order, but the developers are listening to user feedback, and are making changes that they agree would enhance the gameplay. I think this is like the fourth update since the game came out, what, last week? Could you imagine? Meanwhile time marches on, and there's still no patch or ETA. There's only the most marginal updates, and all the devs are keeping their heads way down. I like the line where they say "... All code patches have to go through Infogrames QA..." . Now there's an organizational body I have NO faith in whatsoever. Maybe we should start betting on when the patch will actually come out, that might be a fun diversion, and someone might win back the $50 they WASTED on MOO3.

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by statusperfect


The bugs isn't the problem. The layout of the game itself is the problem.

First I was only saying that too many people want entire bug free game is not realize anymore. When computer first came out the hardware was of one type make by one company to one standard. There where no sound card's only the built in speaker, there was no 3-D accelerate card's, member was measure in kilobytes instead of megabytes. So it was very easy to do hardware programming while programming as you didnot have to worry about afew thousand different standard in viedo card's alone. Some of the first computer game ran on under 128 k of memony which meant they where very short programs and they where many time one file only.

[statusperfect]

Originally posted by habadacus
Hey Guys!

Yo, I just checked out the official MOO3 site, and get this ... THE GAME HAS GONE GOLD!!! YEE-HAH! Finally the wait is over!!!

Meanwhile just to compare how other companies do buisness there was a post on the GalCiv forum time stamped 4/5/2003 12:44:31 AM that V1.02 has been released. Of course these patches aren't huge efforts, because that game went out the door in good working order, but the developers are listening to user feedback, and are making changes that they agree would enhance the gameplay. I think this is like the fourth update since the game came out, what, last week? Could you imagine? Meanwhile time marches on, and there's still no patch or ETA. There's only the most marginal updates, and all the devs are keeping their heads way down. I like the line where they say "... All code patches have to go through Infogrames QA..." . Now there's an organizational body I have NO faith in whatsoever. Maybe we should start betting on when the patch will actually come out, that might be a fun diversion, and someone might win back the $50 they WASTED on MOO3.

From Quiksilver: All code patches have to go through Infogrames QA, so we are bundling changes together. There are still some military AI issues and diplomacy issues we need to address before we are ready to release it to QA. The UI changes being made are not impacting this work, since it is different programmers. We will send the code patch to QA no later than the end of the current month (April).

[Hydro]

Send it to QA by the end of APRIL?!!!

Will there be any people left playing by then?

I do like this game, but I have to say my interest is starting to wane. The bugs are starting to 'bug' me and I find I'm spending more time on polished games like SMAC/X.

I have to say I had high hopes that the patch would re-invigorate the game, and interest. Now I wonder if the patch will be tumbleweed rolling across a deserted, silent plain (with low fertility...).

[habadacus]

You would think that judging from the status updates, that a lot of stuff is already fixed. END OF APRIL?! Don't forget IG.QA was the same body of scholars that let the game go out the door with no AI, faulty PD, and a viceroy with a hardon for troops transports. If they had done their job in the first place, we wouldn't need such a massive patch. Of course on the other hand if they had done their job we'd probably still be waiting for the initial release.
It seems to me like they're doing a lousy job of damage control, they must have known the problems with the game before it released, and so should have been working hard on a patch immediately, and taken all steps to streamline the process to get the patch out ASAP. While they take their time, PC Gamer just released their review - a hot steamy pile of 57%. Do they really think that delaying the patch for "QA" is going to revive interest in this game, or show the community how much they care? What the worst thing that could happen with an untested patch? The gamke will be broken? The damned thing is broken now! The patch should have been out yesterday, at least to show that work was bieng done, and concerns were being addressed, and that QS had the capability to fix these things in a timely manner. Like I say, I'm waiting until the 15th, and then, back it goes. There's about 1000 copies on eBay, maybe I'll try it again in however long it takes for QS to pull their collective heads out of their asses.

[The Rusty Gamer]

Gee, say, you don't think we might be part of the problem do you? I mean, hassling them for ages "When's the game going to be out, when's the game going to be out, when's the game going to be out"?????? Nagging them, brow beating them, bullying them, pressuring them until they finally give in and bring it out even though they knew it needed another two years. Now I think about it maybe that's what the problem was with Civ 3 as well? I mean, we have a go at them about release delays and then have another go at them about bringing out the game prematurely. Yeeesh! These developers can't win can they! Damned if they do and damned if they don't!

Ah, the good old days, the golden era of games before the proliferation of the internet when a game could be created in relative isolation, the developers could relax and take their time with it without thousands of game zealots breathing down their necks. Maybe the first we would even hear about the game is after it is on the shelves, fully tested and well-balanced.

Perhaps it's time we got out of these game developers faces and just let them get on with it.

[OmniDude]

Rusty,

that's the conclusion that I, for one, have reached. After AC, Civ3 and now Moo3, I'm done hanging around prerelease-forums for months - even years! - waiting impatiently.
Spare the dev's of the pressure and me of the almost inevitable disappointment.

[Kahn]

All I have seen so far is a lot of talk about "tweaked code that handled negotiations..." but until they put up something that real people can download, and fixes the crash bugs for the 60% of consumers who can't play it, I wouldn't advise getting too excited, and I, in turn, will withhold my final judgment upon the game.

The most alarming indicator that all hope may be lost though, is the fact that anyone having real technical problems with the game, posting at the Infogrames forums is immediately decended upon by very vocal minority (about 20), who attack them like a pack of wild wolves. If the complainer is technically compentent, then Stencho or somebody just deletes them. Apparently this is what they call "customer service". This does not bode well for the future of MoO3, or Inforgrames as a whole.

[Nirvana_CN]

Well, i have done beta and alpa testing for 5 or 6 games..mostly RTS, Q+A checking on a game can take months in itself, and its not unusual for the Q+A to take longer than the patch itself, i wouldnt expect this patch to be out until at least a month or two after they submit it, so may or june sometime..unless they rush it out i guess.

I much prefer Gal-civ's method of releasing patches every week, with small changes instead of one big patch, it lowers Q+A imensely, and creates a far far happier community.

Dont forget that its Infrogrames who does the Q+A not Quiksilver..and Infrogrames aint known for speedy, or even many patches

[Kahn]

Really though, I fail to believe that this "game" supposedly got through "beta testing" with no one experiencing the dreaded "DirectX surface not available" error that seems to plague more than half the customers now. Logic also tells me not to hold out much hope that tweaking a spreadsheet is going to correct a DX problem that manifests itself even while your watching the Bink intro either. The Bink API is very robust (I've used it myself) and this is the first instance I've seen it fail. Apparently all the programmers must have been asleep during the "Introduction to C++ Programming" class.

I was going to buy GC, but after witnessing this travesty, I've decided to hold on to my money for the time being.

Sad, very sad.

[Jamski]

You're one of the disaffected IGMoO Forum posters aren't you? Welcome to Apolyton Hope you enjoy your stay. I can't believe that some people are so passionate in their attack and defence of MoO3, its only a game after all. Hmm, things are a bit calmer here, thank God.

-Jam

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by Kahn
All I have seen so far is a lot of talk about "tweaked code that handled negotiations..." but until they put up something that real people can download, and fixes the crash bugs for the 60% of consumers who can't play it, I wouldn't advise getting too excited, and I, in turn, will withhold my final judgment upon the game.

The most alarming indicator that all hope may be lost though, is the fact that anyone having real technical problems with the game, posting at the Infogrames forums is immediately decended upon by very vocal minority (about 20), who attack them like a pack of wild wolves. If the complainer is technically compentent, then Stencho or somebody just deletes them. Apparently this is what they call "customer service". This does not bode well for the future of MoO3, or Inforgrames as a whole.

The company that release Pool of Radialate the new one not
the old DOS classist did the same thing they even have than person who didnot even have the game attack the people who did and want patches it was like pulling teeth.
At least QS and Infogames are making than patch on their own.

[The Templar]

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff
The company that release Pool of Radialate the new one not
the old DOS classist did the same thing they even have than person who didnot even have the game attack the people who did and want patches it was like pulling teeth.
At least QS and Infogames are making than patch on their own.

Half the time, I can't even tell what this guy is talking about.

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by vmxa1


Not sure why I should presume they will do some magic in a massive patch, I hope so though.

There was not all that much wrong with Civ3 when it came out. Many improvements were made over time, but the game was fun day 1 for those who liked it.
I have not seen/heard that many saving Moo3 was fun.
Some people liked it, but they are not raving or anything. I played two games, found it hard to continue and await improvements.
IOW Moo3 is no where near as enjoyable as Civ3 was on day 1.

Heh, and MOO3 is fun *from day one* for those who like it as well. Not to say MOO3 isn't without flaws, but trust the fine, FICKLE folks here at APoly to bash any game that doesn't live up to their individual expectations.

If QS is as dedicated to improving MOO3 as Firaxis was with Civ3, then this title will be better than either of the original MOO games.

Two things I have noticed:
1) Get Colin's mod if you want an AI that will actually force you to fight and think more than the default AI (interface issues still persist but the AI actually does seem to have a brain with this mod).
2) The vast majority of the people I have seen bash the crap out of MOO3 are the people who loved MOO2 and never played MOO(original). Personally I hated MOO2 because it was micro nightmare, and if people were expecting MOO2.5 instead of MOO3 they are disappointed. Sounds almost like the same complaints that came from the Civ2 crowd who wanted Civ2.5 and not Civ3 as well, heh.

For what it's worth, I have nothing against the game in general but I have slacked off on playing because having to re-do the Dev plans every game and having to micro-manage the military build queue when virtually everything else is macro manage oriented. Most of the issues I have with the game have been mentioned as being worked on with the patch or future patches. Much as Civ3 was good, it didn't become great and addictive until 1.21 and especially 1.29 patches. I have the same expectations and hopes for MOO3.

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by Kahn
All I have seen so far is a lot of talk about "tweaked code that handled negotiations..." but until they put up something that real people can download, and fixes the crash bugs for the 60% of consumers who can't play it, I wouldn't advise getting too excited, and I, in turn, will withhold my final judgment upon the game.

The most alarming indicator that all hope may be lost though, is the fact that anyone having real technical problems with the game, posting at the Infogrames forums is immediately decended upon by very vocal minority (about 20), who attack them like a pack of wild wolves. If the complainer is technically compentent, then Stencho or somebody just deletes them. Apparently this is what they call "customer service". This does not bode well for the future of MoO3, or Inforgrames as a whole.

Maybe that's why IG has a TECH SUPPORT department where you can write or call to try to resolve your problem instead of *****ing and moaning constantly on the general forums?

SOmetimes the squeaky wheel doesn't get the grease it get's deleted.

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by Nirvana_CN
Well, i have done beta and alpa testing for 5 or 6 games..mostly RTS, Q+A checking on a game can take months in itself, and its not unusual for the Q+A to take longer than the patch itself, i wouldnt expect this patch to be out until at least a month or two after they submit it, so may or june sometime..unless they rush it out i guess.

I much prefer Gal-civ's method of releasing patches every week, with small changes instead of one big patch, it lowers Q+A imensely, and creates a far far happier community.

Dont forget that its Infrogrames who does the Q+A not Quiksilver..and Infrogrames aint known for speedy, or even many patches

Of course, on the flip side, when you release a small patch each week you have folks who take a cursory glance and say "holy cow, this game has had TWENTY patches? I don't even want to look at this buggy piece of crap!"

Six of one, half-dozen of another, whether or not you have 4 patches in a month or one patch that fixes four things in a month, stuff still get's fixed. I could care less how many patches the game recieves as long as they keep patching until most of the MAJOR issues (no military dev plans, etc) are fixed.

Seems like a lot of folks could use a healthy does of patience. I know games that have been out 6 months and haven't been patched *yet*, and I have lived through the DIablo2 fiasco, where each patch BROKE another aspect of the game because they were rushed out with little to NO QA processes, so a little longer, but throughly tested is better than the other way around.

[BobD]

Originally posted by Ozymandous

Seems like a lot of folks could use a healthy does of patience. I know games that have been out 6 months and haven't been patched *yet*, and I have lived through the DIablo2 fiasco, where each patch BROKE another aspect of the game because they were rushed out with little to NO QA processes, so a little longer, but throughly tested is better than the other way around.

I suppose you are one of the lucky few who isn't plagued by the DirectX SU error practically every turn. I personally like this game very much, but until they fix this bug I'm not going to waste any more time reloading the game every 5 minutes .

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by The Templar


Half the time, I can't even tell what this guy is talking about.

The Pool of Radiaion have many bugs that effect gameplay and many bugs that crash the game back to desktop. The company answer was there is no bugs in our game at all. They have this person who didnot even have the game at all
saying there is no need to patch anything. The only problen they patch was the framous MS safe disk uninstall deleteing half of your window files while uninstalling the game forceing
you to do than complete install of window. All the rest that needed to be patch was than major fight in itself. I have MOO 1, MOO2, and MOO3 so I do have the game and play it so I do know it have some problen that needed to be patch.