British Plane shot down by US missiles

Case · March 23, 2003, 05:22

The British seem to be having the worst possible luck.

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From: http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s814102.htm

A British Royal Air Force plane listed as missing after an operation in the Gulf early Sunday (local time) was hit by a United States Patriot missile, a US military official said.

"I can confirm that the British plane was hit by a Patriot," an official with the US Central Command said.

"The crew is missing."

The official who asked not to be named provided no further details.

A Ministry of Defence official in London earlier said the plane had gone missing after an operational mission and "might have been engaged by a US-operated Patriot missile battery near the Kuwaiti border."

He said it was not yet possible to say what sort of plane was involved or how many crew it contained as no families had been contacted.

He also declined to say what mission the aircraft had been carrying out when it went missing.

On Saturday one American and six British servicemen were killed when two Royal Navy Sea King helicopters collided over the Gulf, in what was described as a "tragic accident".

That incident followed another helicopter crash in Kuwait the day before in which eight British Royal Marines and four US airmen were killed.

Dis · March 23, 2003, 05:24

this is bad.

This shows how difficult it is to coordinate attacks between nations.

War hasn't improved much in this area since WW2 normandy invasion it seems.

Chemical Ollie · March 23, 2003, 05:25

Patriot missiles are not.
Friendly fire is not.

Case · March 23, 2003, 05:49

Interestingly, the New York Times report on the fratricide at the US military base in Kuwait includes this phrase:

"Shortly after the grenade attack, a Patriot missile was launched from this camp [Camp New York], about five miles south of Camp Pennsylvania. Sirens roared the alarm, and a mid-air explosion was seen overhead as the Patriot intercepted a missile. It was not immediately clear what kind of missile was shot down, or where it had been fired from."
(http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/23/in...al/23GREN.html)

I wonder if the attack spooked the missile crew into screwing up...

Dis · March 23, 2003, 05:53

weird.

I wonder if they ejected. doubtful.

Demerzel · March 23, 2003, 06:53

Must have lost nearly 20 British servicemen so far and none to enemy fire

CerberusIV · March 23, 2003, 07:49

As I understand it US/UK warplanes carry transponders that should indicate they are friendly when targeted by US/UK radar. Unless the transponder in the Tornado was damaged the implication is that the Patriot crew made a very bad call. If so, I bet they don't get court martialled for it.

Demerzel · March 23, 2003, 08:15

On another forum, someone made possibly a valid point in that the US military has killed more British servicemen than any other country in the last 15 years.

If that is true, that is indeed sad news...

You'd have thought they'd be taking extra precautions after last time.

Dauphin · March 23, 2003, 09:26

WWI:
Germans shoot, French and British duck
French and British shoot, Germans duck
Americans shoot, everybody ducks.

Americans are keeping up a stereotype that they have had for nearly 100 years.

alva · March 23, 2003, 09:33

Anyone else think they are doing this on purpose

BeBro · March 23, 2003, 09:35

Well, as sad as it is, but friendly fire isn´t a US privilege. There were a lot of cases (although on a smaller scale) in WWI and even bigger cases in WWII, also on the German side.

For example, during the operation "Bodenplatte" German AA guns shut down ca. 180 own planes that were returning from attacks against allied airfields on january 1st 1945.

red_jon · March 23, 2003, 12:06

Wow, that was fast.

I have heard that more Britons were killed by Americans than Iraqis in the first Gulf War, but that may just be a myth.

Do the soldiers get punished for friendly fire?

KrazyHorse · March 23, 2003, 12:14

No.

Gibsie · March 23, 2003, 12:23

That's a dumb question. It's like asking "Do American cops get prosecuted for shooting innocent black guys?".

Dis · March 23, 2003, 14:03

oh jeez

we all know black guys are never innocent

Inverse Icarus · March 23, 2003, 14:18

Quote:

Originally posted by Gibsie
That's a dumb question. It's like asking "Do American cops get prosecuted for shooting innocent black guys?".

innocent black guys?

Dauphin · March 23, 2003, 14:20

Friendly fire is an accepted risk in warfare, but when was the last time a US soldier was killed by an Allies friendly fire?

DarthVeda · March 23, 2003, 14:22

It happens

Dis · March 23, 2003, 14:44

We can't help it if our guns shoot more accurately than our allies. We are just good shots

. Or horribly bad shots as the case may be

. You would think all these first person shooters woudl improve our aiming.

DanS · March 23, 2003, 14:49

Well, at least we know the missiles work this time.

Provost Harrison · March 23, 2003, 16:57

LOL, this reminds me of the Russian dog mines which were trained to run under tanks and leave mines which were designed to blow up German tanks...alas these dogs were better than the Russians anticipated, and they could discern and target Russian tanks effectively and left the Germans well alone

Demerzel · March 23, 2003, 21:34

casualties starting to build up now but it certainly doesn't help when something like this happens

Ted Striker · March 23, 2003, 21:36

Sorry Brits.

Ted Striker · March 23, 2003, 21:36

British are to be commended for making alot of sacrifices, they are doing some hard fighting.

Lawrence of Arabia · March 23, 2003, 21:42

sorry isnt going to make them come back to life.

Ted Striker · March 23, 2003, 21:42

DUH

Lawrence of Arabia · March 23, 2003, 21:45

easy to talk about sacrifices which you do not have to give.

ravagon · March 23, 2003, 21:54

Quote:

Originally posted by Dissident
this is bad.
War hasn't improved much in this area since WW2 normandy invasion it seems.

Rather, its just that other areas have improved far more dramatically and that this just stands out due to so few casualties sustained by allied forces in general.
How many tens of thousands of allied deaths during WW2 were due to FF? A much smaller % certainly, but overall this has improved greatly over what once was...

Sava · March 23, 2003, 21:57

Despite the terrible nature of such tragedies so far in this war, I still think it's good that there are more FF indicents than servicepeople being killed by enemy fire.

Ted Striker · March 23, 2003, 22:10

Quote:

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia
easy to talk about sacrifices which you do not have to give.

Shut your mouth you ****ing hypocrite.