has the 1.21 patch for uk version arrived yet? - Page 2

Robert Plomp · April 17, 2003, 05:45

Ming: I'm against piracy as much as you are. I bought for about $400 civ-games so far.
The thing is that this no-cd crack stuff for patches that aren't released for european bought-games are hardly to be token seriously as violating the law.

Pherhaps to the letter, indeed. But it has morely to do with overdue political correctness than with a truthfull anti-piracy policy.

Your policy rather harms the honest game players (like me) than the pirates.
The pirates know where to get their hacks.

But we've had this discussion before, and I don't have the illusion that you'll switch over this time.

Quote:

And your Conclussion is not based on any facts.

I didn't conclude anything. I asked you a question, and when you didn't respond to it, I used another tactic to get the answer. It's called the "Put down a fake conclusion and your victim will come with the real answer"

And look, it worked!
And look, my fake conclusion appeared to be the right conclusion. You didn't got an e-mail ( "I have no clue if an email was sent to Apolyton or not." )

It dissapointsme.
Again: it's easy to maintain this silly policy while you're not harmed by it yourself, but only people who paid $100 for civ3 + civ3

tw.

And I keep saying, if you're under pressure by Firaxis / Infogrames, I completely understand your situation, and I respect it undert hose circumstanses. But if not.......... in that case you're just a loser.

A cop who gives a penalty to someone who speeded 0,2 miles to fast.

Ming · April 17, 2003, 09:44

Quote:

Originally posted by CyberShy
Ming: I'm against piracy as much as you are. I bought for about $400 civ-games so far.
The thing is that this no-cd crack stuff for patches that aren't released for european bought-games are hardly to be token seriously as violating the law.

Pherhaps to the letter, indeed. But it has morely to do with overdue political correctness than with a truthfull anti-piracy policy.

Again... just an assumption on your part... and an incorrect one. The owners are very strict with their anti piracy policy and has NOTHING to do with political correctness.

Quote:

Your policy rather harms the honest game players (like me) than the pirates.
The pirates know where to get their hacks.

That still doesn't change the fact that it is illegal.

Quote:

And look, it worked!
And look, my fake conclusion appeared to be the right conclusion. You didn't got an e-mail ( "I have no clue if an email was sent to Apolyton or not." )

Why would they send an email to me? I am not an owner and I don't make policy decisions at Apolyton.
So again... just another assumption on your part.

Quote:

Again: it's easy to maintain this silly policy while you're not harmed by it yourself, but only people who paid $100 for civ3 + civ3

tw.

Every member of this site would be harmed if it was shut down due to legal action. Only the owners are at risk if people engage in these types of discussions.

Quote:

And I keep saying, if you're under pressure by Firaxis / Infogrames, I completely understand your situation, and I respect it undert hose circumstanses. But if not.......... in that case you're just a loser.

A cop who gives a penalty to someone who speeded 0,2 miles to fast.

The owners have instituted a zero tolerence policy on this subject. Please explain how I'm a loser for doing my job and enforcing the rules as established by the owners of this private site. When you became a member, you agreed to follow the rules as established by the owners. If you don't like the rules, nobody is forcing you to post at this private site...

Maybe you should call the next cop that pulls you over for speeding a loser, and see what happens

Robert Plomp · April 18, 2003, 05:53

Quote:

That still doesn't change the fact that it is illegal.

I'm not sure about that.
If you buy a game and install an official patch, after which the game doesn't work anymore......
I think the owner of a game is authorized to fix the problem.

Quote:

CS: And look, it worked!
And look, my fake conclusion appeared to be the right conclusion. You didn't got an e-mail ( "I have no clue if an email was sent to Apolyton or not." )

Quote:

Ming: just another assumption on your part.

I know you love it to reply with "another assumption" stuff, but in my quote there's really no assumption to be found

Quote:

Every member of this site would be harmed if it was shut down due to legal action. Only the owners are at risk if people engage in these types of discussions.

Sure, like every member would be harmed if it was shut down due to aliens who hijack the ISP that's serving the site.

Quote:

Please explain how I'm a loser for doing my job and enforcing the rules as established by the owners of this private site.

Because your 'work' results in thousands of european civ3

tw players aren't able to play online against americans anymore, since they have upgraded to the 1.21 patch.

In singleplayer games they have to strugle with bugs that are solved already, but they can't use the solution since the silly prog doesn't recognizes the cd in the drive.

And you're a loser for this discussion alone.
Telling people who spend $100 for a game that they're not allowed to talk about a solution to actually play it.

Look at yourself in the mirror.

In your situation you can only be a loser or a hero.
That's the thing with being a mod.
If you're a hero you say: "Markos, piss off. I'm not going to ban people / edit posts / whatever against this."

But you're morely acting like a puppet in this.

Next time a new civ-games comes out I suggest that you buy me the american version and ship it to me, I'll buy you the european version and ship it to you.

Quote:

Maybe you should call the next cop that pulls you over for speeding a loser, and see what happens

I'll surely tell a cop who pulls me over for speeding 0,2 mph too fast that he's a big big loser.
I've actually been pulled over several times for speeding 20 mph too fast. I said "Ok, I deserve a penalty" those times.

But as soon as they'll come with "You speeded 0,2mph" crap, I'll surely tell them they're big big big losers.

Would you really say: "I'm sorry, I deserved this penalty?"

Normal people can see the difference between the letter of the law, and practical problems with this letter in certain situations.
If this situation is not a special situation in which a no-cd crack is allowed, which situation is?

I tell you what,
in Europe during the 2nd world war there were priests who didn't want to help jews because it was against the law.

Fortunately this situation is 100000000 times less important than that situation, but people who stick to the letter of the law like this really make me wonder...

it's just plain silly.

Spiffor · April 18, 2003, 07:15

Quote:

Originally posted by CyberShy

Quote:

That still doesn't change the fact that it is illegal.

I'm not sure about that.
If you buy a game and install an official patch, after which the game doesn't work anymore......
I think the owner of a game is authorized to fix the problem.

Not when the program is not open source. Under normal cpyright regulations, it is forbidden to modify these programs, because it would be reverse-engineering. Cracks are illegal versions of Civ3.exe, except those that have been provided by Infogrames.
CyberShy, I am supportive of your views regarding the moral right of a user to improve a product he has bought, but it is true the advocating of cracks means the advocating of illegal software. And a lawyer would have no trouble shutting down the site if such advocating was recurrent.
Lawyers don't bother with the spirit of the law, except when it fits them. Should any important person in Infogrames Firaxis or alikes be angry about it, he would be able to shut down the site extremely quickly with no possible resistance from Mark and Dan. I know it is dumb, but I'm sure many people in the industry cannot understand when the need for cracks arises, because they understand nothing to videogames themselves.

statusperfect · April 18, 2003, 07:17

Apolyton goes Rikki Lake.

Cruddy · April 18, 2003, 07:33

Phew! What a lot of words! Why doesn't someone say

"bombard Infogrames for that patch if you want it?"

It's strikes me as kind of silly as lots of opinions on what is "the law". It's depends where you live. Like, I don't have the right to free speech, and depending on which state you live in in the US, you can't wear body armour but you can carry a gun (if you're an adult, of course).

Spiffor · April 18, 2003, 07:54

Apolyton is hosted on a Texan server, and as such is under the SU and Texas laws, IIRC

alva · April 18, 2003, 08:16

Quote:

Originally posted by panag

hi ,

you got a point but , its for the player to make , why play a game that you cant play , ...

but think of this ; what message do you send them by not buying your local version , .....

they have also started to see the numbers from overseas players who buy the game , .... in US english

have a nice day

Panag, to be honest I hate localised versions, and guess what, mine isn't.
I do have the english-english version (from my POV, hardly local is it

)
I already payed 50$ as it stands and was not interested in paying more to get it a week earlier, besides, I don't have a credit-card...

(local shop, found another a week later that sold it for like 30$ of course

, anyways...)

Can you tell me btw, why there even is an english and an american version, surely either the english or the americans would survive the shock when reading such atrocities as 'lift' instead of 'elevator' or vice-versa. However that would one mean one version (for quit a big audience I might add) less to screw up

Look how the latest CM (championship manager 4) was released...plain english only, yes, that's right. However, they are making other languages available as a (hold thight here) free download!!!

. How is that for killing two birds with one stone.
-

Like I have said before, I know of the creative solutions out there, (hell I had one within 48 hours, and IIRC the one for Civ3_1.29 was there within 24) but if one person on a PBEM feels akward to use it (whitch I fully respect btw), no one can upgrade.
-
Here endeth the rant :relieved:

edit: quoted wrong quote

Panag · April 18, 2003, 11:22

Quote:

Originally posted by alva

Panag, to be honest I hate localised versions, and guess what, mine isn't.
I do have the english-english version (from mine POV, hardly local is it

)
I already payed 50$ as it stands and was not interested in paying more to get it a week earlier, besides, I don't have a credit-card...

(local shop, found another a week later that sold it for like 30$ of course

, anyways...)

Can you tell me btw, why there even is an english and an american version, surely either the english or the americans would survive the shock when reading such atrocities as 'lift' instead of 'elevator' or vice-versa. However that would one mean one version (for quit a big audience I might add) less to screw up

Look how the latest CM (championship manager 4) was released...plain english only, yes, that's right. However, they are making other languages available as a (hold thight here) free download!!!

. How is that for killing two birds with one stone.
-

Like I have said before, I know of the creative solutions out there, (hell I had one within 48 hours, and IIRC the one for Civ3_1.29 was there within 24) but if one person on a PBEM feels akward to use it (whitch I fully respect btw), no one can upgrade.
-
Here endeth the rant :relieved:

hi ,

huh , your point is taken , but what does that have to do with a death link

by the way , the best and cheapest way to pick up a copy in US english is in brussels , one shop near the stock exchange sells second hand copies from time to time , there is a free record shop near the namur gate who has had them , and there is the cash and carry called makro , the last one sold them for 25.99 and there was a discount a couple months ago of minus 7.5 or so when you bought for 50 bucks of software , ......

imagine they start with a dutch version , one for belgium and one for the netherlands , ....

anyway , you can always have a dual install , ......

have a nice day

Ribannah · April 30, 2003, 04:28

* bump *

Spiffor · April 30, 2003, 09:37

Indeed, it has still not arrived

Demerzel · April 30, 2003, 10:12

CM4 is writing new records for how many bugs can be left unfixed by release day. There have been several "enhancement packs" ( i.e. patches ) for that already and still a hell of a lot of bugs still to be fixed.

Quite amusing when we all *****ed over how bugged Civ3 was and CM4 is much much more buggy. never thought that'd be possible at the time

Spiffor · April 30, 2003, 10:16

What is CM4 ?

Demerzel · April 30, 2003, 10:33

incredibly buggy!

Championship Manager 4 - a football manager simulation to its fans & a glorified spreadsheet to others

Panag · April 30, 2003, 23:59

Quote:

Originally posted by Spiffor
Indeed, it has still not arrived

hi ,

funny how info grames gives no comment on it neither , ........

have a nice day

CerberusIV · May 1, 2003, 05:41

The 1.14f patch didn't take this long. I am beginning to wonder if we are to get a patch or will be left to buy the next expansion pack (whenever that turns up).

Asmodeus · May 1, 2003, 07:23

I'm just sick of waiting for this. InfraGreed can shove it where the sun dont shine. There are much better publishers and software houses our there who deliver damned good products without shafting the people who pay their f*cking salaries.

I wont waste any more time or ASCII on this poxy unreliable company.

Panag · May 1, 2003, 10:51

Quote:

Originally posted by CerberusIV
The 1.14f patch didn't take this long. I am beginning to wonder if we are to get a patch or will be left to buy the next expansion pack (whenever that turns up).

hi ,

well many people have speculated that there will be no more patches for the local versions , ......

lets hope thats not true

could someone please give us an anwer on this

mailing this to infogrames and firaxis

have a nice day

Ribannah · May 1, 2003, 13:25

Mailing to Info-lames is of no use. They never reply to e-mail.
Firaxis will simply refer you to Infogrames, if they answer.

Panag · May 1, 2003, 14:18

Quote:

Originally posted by Ribannah
Mailing to Info-lames is of no use. They never reply to e-mail.
Firaxis will simply refer you to Infogrames, if they answer.

hi ,

well i happen to know a couple people who work there , they have always ansered , to the best of their knowledge , .....

as for firaxis , well we could always ask in the next chat , ....

have a nice day

astrologix · May 6, 2003, 05:32

I've followed the CyberShy advice and wrote a message to Infogrames.

I got this answer today :

.......................

Hi,

We are sorry about the delay in the release of the 1.21f patch for CIV 3 PTW.

I can assure you that we on the helpdesk are actively chasing this patch up and hope to have some information on it soon.

Please reply all mails with full history so that your problem can be dealt with in a timely fashion.

Regards,

Andrew Craig

Customer Support
Infogrames UK
21 Castle Street
Castlefield
Manchester
M3 4SW

-----Original Message-----
From: astrologix (in fact my RL real name)
Sent: 03 May 2003 22:05
To: support@uk.infogrames.com
Subject: UK-PTW : when can I get the 1.21f patch

Hi,

I've purchased the UK versions of Civ3 and PTW via Amazon.uk.

I'm very worried because the PTW 1.21f patch is not yet available for my localized version and would like to have a word from you on this matter.

The current 1.14f version I'm using has plenty of bugs and I wonder how long you intend to keep frustrated customers as I am.

Thanks for your answer.

astrologix, Switzerland

Panag · May 6, 2003, 06:46

hi ,

guys , talk to your dealers , point out that the local version aint good , ask them to order a US copy , that should not be a problem as dealers can get almost anything if they want , .....

try talking to your local infogrames dealer , .....

( we got in the hospital a batch for the childrens dep true one of them )

and if all else fails , well ask a friend , a relative if they go to the states or know someone , ....

there is a guy from Tel - Aviv who asked several people at the airport , ... and he got lucky , ....

be creative , ....

and if all else fails i travel around the globe , .... so are some other posters , ....

together
everyone
achieves
more

have a nice day

statusperfect · May 6, 2003, 08:55

Well spoken panag.