Man-made map or Computer map?

BigFurryMonster · April 7, 2003, 08:09

One poll was still missing, but Here It Is (Civ Demo Game pun intended): the choice whether to play on a computer generated map or a man-made map.

In this thread, a plan was launched to form a small committee (of 2 people) that makes a map using the editor. This map will then be used in the Part Deux Demo Game. The people who made the map will not play an active role in the game itself, of course.

Why use a custom map? Well, there are a number of advantages:

The most obvious advantage is that computer generated maps are always predictable to some degree. You just know that if you vote for pangea, you'll end up on a huge landmass. It almost always extends west-east, and its features are rather 'dull'.
The second advantage is that humans can in fact make a map more challenging for the team. Certain geographical features can be added that include riddles and puzzles. I'm not going to elaborate on this one, since it would spoil the fun.
Ah yes, the most important advantage: a custom made map will be more fun to play on.
Another idea that we have at this moment is to include some of earth's natural features, like mountain ranges, fjords and rivers, to have a "real world" feel to it. In Togas' words: "stunning, natural, and distinct".
We will accomodate the people's wishes: for example, a strong accent on naval warfare.

Of course, a number of conditions must be met. Starting positions should be balanced, every resource type should be present, etc. - nothing too much out-of-the-ordinary. Also, no civ should be completely isolated.
Believe us - it will be challenging!

We hope you vote for our ideas!

Togas
BFM

UnOrthOdOx · April 7, 2003, 08:53

Sure, watch them give us an island surrounded by mountains with no chance of a port...

Vote Man-Made, let them do their worst!

BigFurryMonster · April 7, 2003, 09:24

That would be too easy - those mountains would be too defendable... ;-)

Fishman · April 7, 2003, 11:57

With a computer generated map, we could start immediately while the interest level is still high. While I don't always love the map generater, it gets us started quick.

How long would we have to wait for a man made-map?

If a man made-map is used, volcanos and fog (or suitable other secrets) could be added for diversity and interest (see CivFanatics GOTM 17).

Togas · April 7, 2003, 12:34

I think that our map can be ready within two weeks, or earlier if necessary. What it the tentative start date for the new game? GodKing has suggested April 27. If that date is chosen we could surely have a map ready before then.

--Togas

Beta · April 7, 2003, 12:50

Man-made. Bring it on!

Kloreep · April 7, 2003, 16:52

Very well, give us a challenge.

ZargonX · April 7, 2003, 18:12

If they can have a man-made map in short order, then lets go for it!

Kuciwalker · April 7, 2003, 19:59

Computer map - the computer is probably better at balancing things, plus it doesn't have any even potential biases.

MrWhereItsAt · April 7, 2003, 23:28

Thanks for correcting my omission, BFM. Poll is now (obviously) topped.

I'd like a random map simply because it's simple and we can start right away, but I have no issues with a man-made one.

Panag · April 8, 2003, 06:58

hi ,

if we are to take a man made map , we should take a world map , .....

with correct starting locations (!)

"Marla's Map" would be intresting , .....

have a nice day

BigFurryMonster · April 8, 2003, 07:05

That would be very predictable, now, wouldn't it ..?

theViking · April 8, 2003, 07:29

Quote:

Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
I'd like a random map simply because it's simple and we can start right away, but I have no issues with a man-made one.

Yes, let's go for a random map.

TheStinger · April 8, 2003, 08:48

random

Jethro83 · April 8, 2003, 08:55

Man-made. A natural-looking, well-balanced world sounds more fun than a randomly generated world.

GodKing · April 8, 2003, 10:48

Man Made.

Inverse Icarus · April 8, 2003, 14:04

have we deicded who will make the map?

Togas · April 8, 2003, 15:07

BFM and I are jointly working on a World Map that is natural, balanced, unusual, and also includes a few puzzles and surprises.

We can have it ready within a week if needed, and we welcome any requests for features that you might like to see.

We will be using the results of the polls and try to make the map along those guidelines.

We have many good ideas that we've planned for this map and are coming up with new ideas on a daily basis. We're very excited about this project and hope that Apolyton chooses to use our map.

--Togas

Gramphos · April 8, 2003, 15:50

man-made

Panag · April 9, 2003, 11:12

hi ,

if we use man made , how far do we go , where do we draw the line , .......

have a nice day

joncnunn · April 9, 2003, 12:41

If we use a man made map, won't we have an unfair advantage exploring?

Hot Mustard · April 9, 2003, 13:50

Quote:

Originally posted by joncnunn
If we use a man made map, won't we have an unfair advantage exploring?

Ahem, first post.

Quote:

Originally posted by BigFurryMonster
The people who made the map will not play an active role in the game itself, of course.

Panag · April 9, 2003, 16:17

hi ,

we could ask someone who is not going to play to make a map for us , ....

or we could ask someone from an other site , ......

this way we dont know a thing about it , ....

but what do we want on our man made map , .....

and how long will it take to create it , .....

maybe its better to let the comp generate one , or a couple and take the best from it , then add or remove what we like , ...

have a nice day

BigFurryMonster · April 9, 2003, 17:09

Quote:

Originally posted by panag
we could ask someone who is not going to play to make a map for us , ....

We are. Togas and I are working on a map right now, and it's coming along very nicely. But... we won't tell you a thing in advance, we promise. We'll not be an active part of the game.

Quote:

Originally posted by panag
and how long will it take to create it , .....

One day? One week? You'll have your map before the game starts, I promise.

Quote:

Originally posted by panag
maybe its better to let the comp generate one , or a couple and take the best from it , then add or remove what we like , ...

Actually, that's exactly the way we started the project... :-)

Panag · April 9, 2003, 17:30

Quote:

Originally posted by BigFurryMonster

We are. Togas and I are working on a map right now, and it's coming along very nicely. But... we won't tell you a thing in advance, we promise. We'll not be an active part of the game.

One day? One week? You'll have your map before the game starts, I promise.

Actually, that's exactly the way we started the project... :-)

hi ,

ya know something BFM , its a shame you are not going to play with us , ........

huh , what size ?

could you post a screenshot of a starting point

have a nice day

Togas · April 9, 2003, 17:50

Some notes from the Mapmakers:

We generated several maps with the conditions voted upon by the team as our guidelines, then sketched out a major revision of that map based on ideas that BFM & I each had. The map has Vikings and sea adventures at the heart and while we hope the team will end up with Vikings, it can still be enjoyed by any civ selected. This will be a map that you will enjoy exploring and hopefully surprise you on several occasions.

We are currently setting it up for 16 civs. We'll do more or less if needed, just let us know.

Design wise, I'd say we're 1/3 of the way done. We could have it ready as soon as this Sunday, if you wanted it by then.

BFM and I will stay involved in the Demo game to some degree, of course. We won't run for office or anything, but we will definately want to see how things play out on this map and what you discover and what you think of it.

--Togas

civman2000 · April 9, 2003, 21:24

Togas: You could be on the Court, if we have one.

Sheik · April 9, 2003, 21:27

Man-made. A human editor is much more creative and can add elements to the map that a computer can't.

Jonny · April 9, 2003, 21:55

I want a computer-generated map.

It will let us get started quickly, and the computer holds no biases against anyone. A computer map would be well balanced.

GodKing · April 10, 2003, 12:09

Sounds like Togas and BFM are going to get us a good one....