Designated hitter - Page 3

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 02:23

I like it.

Watching NL pichers get free outs is far to boring.

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 02:25

While light hitting infielders getting free outs isn't?

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 02:28

I watched Glavine get two free outs tonight, the #8 and the pitcher, with the bases loaded and none out.

Wouldn't have happened in the AL.

I know a lot of people love the strategy, but I feel it's over-rated.

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 02:39

Quote:

I watched Glavine get two free outs tonight, the #8 and the pitcher, with the bases loaded and none out.

Wouldn't have happened in the AL.

You don't watch Tampa do you? With our old friend Rey Ordonez in the 9 spot. Don't let those RBIs fool you, they'll be 1/4th of his total this year.

Play the game the way it was meant to. There is NO rational reason for having a designated hitter. By the same logic, I want to have a DH for a light hitting, great fielding SS or 2B (such as Alex Cora in LA, Orlando Cabrera in Mon or Rey Sanchez in NY, etc, etc). You make a special rule for pitchers, you can't justify not extending it.

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 02:48

That "play the game" argument is a little lame, they played it WITHOUT a shortstop for over 20 years.

NOBODY plains it like they used too!

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 02:52

Quote:

That "play the game" argument is a little lame, they played it WITHOUT a shortstop for over 20 years.

Since the rules were codified (and it became a 'real' sport, rather than simply a game), they played it with 9 players who hit and fielded. Where they played and what they were called changed with strategy, but they never changed the RULES doing so.

Why can't I have a DH for Rey Ordonez, or the Tigers' SS?

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 02:55

I like it, I know the "purist" argument, but I find the NL often boring with all the "moves", that ofetn include pinch hitters who THEMSELVES should be pinch hit for!

Plus you know the MLPA will NEVER let it go.

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 02:58

Quote:

I find the NL often boring with all the "moves"

It's called strategy, Chris. I'm sure that you being an AL fan have no idea what that is

.

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Plus you know the MLPA will NEVER let it go.

I would trade a year of strike/lockout to get rid of the DH. Seriously. It's that much of an abomination.

--

Btw, you never answered my question:

Quote:

Why can't I have a DH for Rey Ordonez, or the Tigers' SS?

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 03:04

Why can't you have TWO wives?

Cause one is enough!

Same with DHs.

I'm not saying you shouldn't like it, but I don't.

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 03:09

That's ok. As long as you don't get too worked up when I abolish the DH when I become the Commish of Baseball

. Of course that will be right before I abolish interleague play and try to figure out how to get rid of the Wild Card

.

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 03:17

It wouldn't kill me to see it go, I can actually remember the AL WITHOUT it!

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 03:21

Old bastard

.

MRT144 · April 11, 2003, 03:24

Imran, you also need to take away the juiced ball and center fields that are less than 450 ft

Chris 62 · April 11, 2003, 03:30

Taking out juiced players would be good also.

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 03:39

I don't care about the center fields that are less than 450 (most HRs are down RF or LF anyway). The ball isn't juiced. It is the fact that down LF in, say, Minute Maid Park (Houston), it is like 310!!

MRT144 · April 11, 2003, 03:48

well the idea is that with center field pushed out the rest of the fence would follow, unless we want some polo grounds action...

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 15:21

I doubt it MRT... we'd see some Polo Grounds action. Center is ok, but right and left in some parks are just too small.

Ming · April 11, 2003, 15:26

I like interleague play. Every other major sport allows it.

What's your problem with it besides tradition. Because tradition really isn't that good of an argument. Many things change in baseball all the time... And frankly, I think the Cubs playing the White Sox, or the Mets playing the Yankees during the regular season is one of the best things in baseball today.

Arrian · April 11, 2003, 15:28

I've thought about this some more (my original answer was "don't care") and have decided I agree with Chris.

I like the DH. No, it doesn't make sense. But there is a helluva lot in baseball that doesn't make sense, and that's part of what makes baseball cool.

I agree with Imran on interleague play (it's crap) but not on the wild card.

@ Rey Ordonez. The Devil Rays' RBI leader!

That kills me.

-Arrian

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 17:24

Quote:

What's your problem with it besides tradition. Because tradition really isn't that good of an argument. Many things change in baseball all the time... And frankly, I think the Cubs playing the White Sox, or the Mets playing the Yankees during the regular season is one of the best things in baseball today.

There is more to it than tradition. It makes the All-Star Game mean something. It makes the World Series better, because you have teams that haven't seen each other play against each other.

I like the idea of two seperate leagues, with different commishs. I don't like this baseball becoming like every other game. I hate watching baseball during interleague, especially when you have to get around those DH problems (NL has to find one, AL has to live without).

Quote:

I like the DH. No, it doesn't make sense. But there is a helluva lot in baseball that doesn't make sense, and that's part of what makes baseball cool.

But what's the need for it? We don't need the increased offense anymore (the reason for introducing it). I'd rather see more pitchers duels and less 9-7 gams.

Ming · April 11, 2003, 17:28

Well let me ask you another question then. Did you like Professional Football better when there were two leagues and they only played in the Super Bowl?

I like the NFL as it is now...

I like the opportunity to see the American League teams play in Wrigley Field... because if I would have to wait for a World Series to see it... I NEVER WILL

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 17:33

MLB isn't the NFL.

The tradition argument isn't dumb, btw. It's the ONLY thing that baseball has over every other sport. Every other sport (in the US) has changed so much that tradition means nothing. In baseball it MEANS something. Williams' .406, Aaron's 755, Dimaggio's 56 etc. have great meaning, which other sports can't match.

And with the DH, it makes interleague games a joke, because teams have to play with different rules than they are used to (which is also a problem with the DH in the World Series).

--

And you know what... I probably wouldn't mind if the NFL segregated the Conferences. That would make it interesting. I mean how boring was it in 1996 (San Fran v. San Diego) when the teams played like 6 weeks before hand and the Niners KILLED the Chargers? Anti-climactic.

Tuberski · April 11, 2003, 17:38

Quote:

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Why can't I have a DH for Rey Ordonez, or the Tigers' SS?

Actually, a DH for every Tiger wouldn't be a bad idea......

ACK!

Ming · April 11, 2003, 17:43

Hmmm... you talk about tradition, and then you mention the DH in the next paragraph....

Baseball has changed as much as any other sport...

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 17:45

Quote:

you talk about tradition, and then you mention the DH in the next paragraph

Haven't I said I'm against the DH?

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Baseball has changes as much as any other sport...

It shouldn't... or else baseball means little. Tradition is the major thing going for it at this point in time. This is why the AL sucks.

Interleague play sucks more

. It's a dumb gimmick.

Ming · April 11, 2003, 17:49

Unlike your Football example... it's not the same in Baseball. A seven game World Series is totaly different than a three game series played earlier in the year.

But I'm with you in dropping the DL... and I would get rid of the wild card as well. However, I like the current league structure now. Many smaller divisions... but I would only let the winner of the division advance. In the "old" days... most teams were out of it by the end of July when only two teams would advance.

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 17:52

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A seven game World Series is totaly different than a three game series played earlier in the year.

It ain't that different.

And besides it seriously unbalances the schedule (at least the way it is set up). Having the 'geographical' rivals play each other makes it much harder for, say, the Mets to beat out the Braves (who in most years don't have to play the Yanks).

Ming · April 11, 2003, 18:02

The game really is for the fans... And it's nice for those fans in the cities that don't have Both leagues represented like we do in Chicago and other Major markets a chance to see the other great teams.

It adds some excitement during the long season. The cost of a Yankees ticket at Wrigley is higher than for the White Sox Series. The atmosphere will be like an All Star game...

The FANS like it... therefore, I like it

Imran Siddiqui · April 11, 2003, 18:09

Screw the fans

.

What the fans want isn't necessarily always good for the game. I'm sure the fans in the AL like the DH. The FANS love having expanded playoffs, so they have a better chance to see a playoff game (they love the Wild Card, which you don't). I don't want to see 14 teams make the playoffs. That would be a disaster.

It messes up the season, giving some teams an advantage because they don't have to play the big guys that their rivals have to play makes a difference when teams win the Wild Card by 1 game some years.

Why have leagues at all? Why not just seed the teams from 1-8, regardless of what league they play in? I'm sure the fans would like that idea. After all, who cares about tradition?

Ming · April 11, 2003, 18:17

The schedule is already not perfect. "WHEN you play a team is as important as who you play. Nothing you can do will make it exactly fair for all teams in a division to win.

The game has changed... but if you really want "tradition"... why don't you advocate that we go back to the old system. Just two leagues, and just two champions... Frankly, I wouldn't want that. It's hard enough as it is for the Cubs already