American/European dates?

Adagio · May 16, 2003, 17:26

No, I'm not talking about "you just met a girl/guy, you'd like to date"

I'm talking about the differences in how dates are written:

In Denmark (and other European countries), we write our dates with dd-mm-yyyy (d = day, m = month... you get the idea

), while in America (and probably other countries too), they write their dates in some completely different way... I think it's yyyy-mm-dd, but sometimes I also see it like mm-dd-yyyy...

This has annoyed me pretty much lately, since I'm doing my first examen project for school, where we should do the programming our-self. One of the worst hurdles we had, was this date thing... it was pretty diffecult to get it working, because we were programming our program on an english OS, with english apps and such, but the program should be designed to danes (meaning: we should be sure to use danish dates). It took us ages to find some way, to make this program work... though I believe this program wont work on danish computers, because we wrote the program to english computers... (None of our teachers knew how to get rid of this 'date' problem...)

I think this is pretty annoying, and believe it should be changed. I see a problem, when talking to Americans, and talking about e.g. "let's talk again this date", and then they give some date e.g. "05-04-03"... I know I'm not always aware of this problem, so I could easily see this as April 5th 2003, while others see this as May 4th 2003

Should this be changed? If so: Who should change?

Rogan Josh · May 16, 2003, 17:33

You may as well have just had a poll asking who is European and who is American, because all the Euros will vote for dd-mm-yy and all the Ameris mm-dd-yy.

Starchild · May 16, 2003, 17:34

Day-Month-Year. Logical sense as it's the smallest unit ascending to the largest unit.

Stefu · May 16, 2003, 17:35

dd-mm-yyyy. dd-mm-yyyy. Damn, that doesn't make much of a chant, now does it?

Hm. deedee-emem-waiwaiwaiwai. deedee-emem-waiwaiwaiwai. It does, actually.

Asher · May 16, 2003, 17:36

The problem is how they're read.

mm-dd-yy makes more sense for Americans because days are described as, say "April 1st, 2003" rather than "1 April, 2003", which sounds just...ridiculous.

Oerdin · May 16, 2003, 17:37

Month-day-year.

Starchild · May 16, 2003, 17:41

In what way does "1st of April, 2003" sound any more ridiculous than "April 1st, 2003"?

Adagio · May 16, 2003, 17:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Rogan Josh
You may as well have just had a poll asking who is European and who is American, because all the Euros will vote for dd-mm-yy and all the Ameris mm-dd-yy.

Not necessary... I was close on voting mm-dd-yy, because I often talk to not-European people anyway... so I kinda got used to the other thing anyway...

Apocalypse · May 16, 2003, 17:43

Quote:

Originally posted by Asher
The problem is how they're read.

mm-dd-yy makes more sense for Americans because days are described as, say "April 1st, 2003" rather than "1 April, 2003", which sounds just...ridiculous.

I agree with the slut here

alva · May 16, 2003, 17:44

Yep, in durch you 1 april, 2003, doesn't sound too foolish to me

Dauphin · May 16, 2003, 17:51

I prefer dd-mm-yyyy in general and common use such as dating letters.

yyyy-mm-dd is more useful when archiving, referencing or other somesuch.

Spiffor · May 16, 2003, 18:06

yyyy-mm-dd should be the norm in anything that demands precision (such as a program, archives, etc). It is the most rational way by far.
For the daily use of dates, I think people should stick to whatever they're used to. When I'm talking on 'Poly (i.e to Yanks and Euros), I say dates in full letters anyway, for everybody to understand.

Giant_Squid · May 16, 2003, 18:09

Okay...monarchs. We have Charles I, Elizabeth II, Louis XIV. Not 1st Charles, 2nd Elizabeth, 14th Louis.

World Wars. We have World War I and World War II, not 1st of World Wars and Second of World Wars (yeah, some historians call it "the first world war" to sound special, but that doesn't count)

Movie sequels. We have Rocky II, Star Wars IV, not 2nd of Rocky, 4th of Star Wars.

Fighter jets...we have the F-14, F-15, F-16. Not the 14-F, 15-F, 16-F.

I could go on....but...you say the thing first, and then the number that it uses. That's just the natural way to do things. Why do those crazy Europeans insist on just messing it up for dates?

Harovan · May 16, 2003, 18:10

yyyy-mm-dd makes the most sense. First the most significant unit, then the lower. We also don't say, that it's 28 minutes, 35 seconds of the 11th hour, do we?

Harovan · May 16, 2003, 18:12

Quote:

Originally posted by Giant_Squid
World Wars. We have World War I and World War II, not 1st of World Wars and Second of World Wars (yeah, some historians call it "the first world war" to sound special, but that doesn't count)

Actually, both in German and Russian "First World War and Second World War" are the right order of words. Besides, I don't see what this has to do with dates.

Boris Godunov · May 16, 2003, 18:17

Quote:

Originally posted by Starchild
Day-Month-Year. Logical sense as it's the smallest unit ascending to the largest unit.

Except no one says, "12 January, 2003." We say "January 12, 2003."

MM-DD-YY mirrors spoken language, so makes the most sense.

Boris Godunov · May 16, 2003, 18:17

Quote:

Originally posted by Asher
The problem is how they're read.

mm-dd-yy makes more sense for Americans because days are described as, say "April 1st, 2003" rather than "1 April, 2003", which sounds just...ridiculous.

Oops, beat me to it.

Boris Godunov · May 16, 2003, 18:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Starchild
In what way does "1st of April, 2003" sound any more ridiculous than "April 1st, 2003"?

Who do you know that, when asked the date, says "Oh, it's 1st of April!" as opposed to "It's April 1st!" Simplicity is best, and the "of" is totally unneccessary. It's a whole word no one need say.

Asher · May 16, 2003, 18:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Apocalypse
I agree with the slut here

I told you the dates on AIM, I didn't expect you to broadcast them to everyone on Poly...

As far as people here are concerned, I'm a hermit.

Spiffor · May 16, 2003, 18:23

Quote:

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Actually, both in German and Russian "First World War and Second World War" are the right order of words. Besides, I don't see what this has to do with dates.

Same in French, as well as the French order of words in dates is dd-mm-yy (still more rational than the jam in use in the US, even though it is not perfect).

Oerdin · May 16, 2003, 18:27

Ahh, but you see neither German or Russian nor even French are the de facto world language so guess who's going to win in this dispute?

Drogue · May 16, 2003, 18:40

Quote:

Originally posted by Boris Godunov

Who do you know that, when asked the date, says "Oh, it's 1st of April!" as opposed to "It's April 1st!"

Me. I tend to use both, it just depends what comes out first. I think dd-mm-yyyy is best, because it's from smallest to biggest. And GS: Euro's messing up the date? IIRC, we had it first, and Americans decided to change it. Although I could be wrong

Apocalypse · May 16, 2003, 18:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Asher
I told you the dates on AIM, I didn't expect you to broadcast them to everyone on Poly...

As far as people here are concerned, I'm a hermit.

Hey, I didn't tell anyone why you were a slut...you did that just now.

Come on, people change...you don't have to be a hermit here forever.

Sandman · May 16, 2003, 18:42

Day-month-year, it's the most logical.

I say either "The 1st of April" or "April the 1st", but never ever "April 1st".

And it is "The First World War" and the "The Second World War".

What are those thingies in the American constitution called, those amendments? Amendment 1st? Amendment 2nd?

If you have children do you have a 2nd son, or a son 2nd?

When trying to pass a driving test, do you have attempt third, or a third attempt?

When playing golf, is there hole 18th, or an 18th hole?

Can one be second best, or best second? Third last, or last third?

Drogue · May 16, 2003, 18:43

Quote:

Originally posted by Oerdin
Ahh, but you see neither German or Russian nor even French are the de facto world language so guess who's going to win in this dispute?

Nope, that would be English. And you know what we use over here. Although many would argue that their isn't a world language, since we still all speak our own, and English still isn't the most popular IIRC.

JohnT · May 16, 2003, 18:45

And to think I thought this was a relationship thread. I apparently forgot where I was.

Boris Godunov · May 16, 2003, 18:49

Quote:

Originally posted by Sandman
Day-month-year, it's the most logical.

I say either "The 1st of April" or "April the 1st", but never ever "April 1st".

And it is "The First World War" and the "The Second World War".

What are those thingies in the American constitution called, those amendments? Amendment 1st? Amendment 2nd?

If you have children do you have a 2nd son, or a son 2nd?

When trying to pass a driving test, do you have attempt third, or a third attempt?

When playing golf, is there hole 18th, or an 18th hole?

Can one be second best, or best second? Third last, or last third?

So is she Second Elizabeth, or Elizabeth the Second?

Buck Birdseed · May 16, 2003, 18:54

"April third" is ungramatical, at least if you're intending for the quantifier to be a component of the month. You don't say "the highjumper third attempt", you say "the highjumper's third attempt" or "the third attempt of the highjumper", ie. "April's third" would work, but then we don't use months that way. So language favours the europeans.

I still think they're wrong, because obviously the most natural way is to do it like time or weight or length, largest unit first, ie. yy-mm-dd. AFAIK sweden is the only country that has it standardised this way. I'm born in 810610 (åttiett nollsex tio) myself.

Sandman · May 16, 2003, 18:54

She's Elizabeth THE Second, not Elizabeth Second.

On day third, Christ rose again.

In the future, there will be Coming Second.

Buck Birdseed · May 16, 2003, 18:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Boris Godunov

So is she Second Elizabeth, or Elizabeth the Second?

Oh, you're introducting another word now, "the"? Which is shorter, "the" or "of"?

Another european advantage- if you want to clarify the number of the month while speaking you can do so, ie. "third of the fourth". This is clearly impossible using the American system.