Thread Tools
Old June 12, 2003, 23:13   #61
mrmitchell
Civilization III Democracy GamePtWDG RoleplayCall to Power Democracy GameInterSite Democracy Game: Apolyton TeamNationStatesPtWDG2 Tabemono
King
 
mrmitchell's Avatar
 
Local Time: 21:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,394
I probably should have clarified. Language is a different issue, that gets entangled in efficiency. I never said everyone should speak a different language, or some should learn English while some don't, or English should be used across the world, or whutever it is you think I said. I really had issue with the cultural part. X said "learn our culture or run back home", and unless you're living in a defined ethnic state, shouldn't it be fair that you have a different culture from your neighbor, just as long as you can still live together?
---
And about the right-to-not-not-be-offended-bit: I was exercising my right to be offended. As long as I didn't try to stop you from offending me, I was in clear zone.
__________________
meet the new boss, same as the old boss
mrmitchell is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:13   #62
Ted Striker
Apolytoners Hall of Fame
Emperor
 
Ted Striker's Avatar
 
Local Time: 19:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Batallón de San Patricio, United States of America
Posts: 3,696
...are bad azz mf'ers
__________________
"Let the People know the facts and the country will be saved." Abraham Lincoln

Mis Novias
Ted Striker is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:14   #63
Spiffor
Civilization III Democracy GamePtWDG LegolandApolytoners Hall of Fame
 
Spiffor's Avatar
 
Local Time: 05:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: jihadding against Danish Feta
Posts: 6,182
Long time no see, Ted. How are you doing ?
__________________
"I have been reading up on the universe and have come to the conclusion that the universe is a good thing." -- Dissident
"I never had the need to have a boner." -- Dissident
"I have never cut off my penis when I was upset over a girl." -- Dis
Spiffor is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:16   #64
Urban Ranger
NationStatesApolyton Storywriters' GuildNever Ending Stories
Deity
 
Urban Ranger's Avatar
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
Re: We, the sensible people of the United States,...
There's a group of sensible people outside your door who want to have a word with you.
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Urban Ranger is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:17   #65
Urban Ranger
NationStatesApolyton Storywriters' GuildNever Ending Stories
Deity
 
Urban Ranger's Avatar
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
Quote:
Originally posted by Spiffor
Long time no see, Ted. How are you doing ?
What do you mean? Didn't you see him letting loose in other threads?
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Urban Ranger is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:17   #66
Ted Striker
Apolytoners Hall of Fame
Emperor
 
Ted Striker's Avatar
 
Local Time: 19:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Batallón de San Patricio, United States of America
Posts: 3,696
Quote:
Originally posted by Spiffor
Long time no see, Ted. How are you doing ?
Very good, thanks.

How is Deutschland?

How is your woman?
__________________
"Let the People know the facts and the country will be saved." Abraham Lincoln

Mis Novias
Ted Striker is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:23   #67
Spiffor
Civilization III Democracy GamePtWDG LegolandApolytoners Hall of Fame
 
Spiffor's Avatar
 
Local Time: 05:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: jihadding against Danish Feta
Posts: 6,182
Quote:
Originally posted by Ted Striker


Very good, thanks.

How is Deutschland?
Pretty good thanks. The weather is way too hot these days, but I'm beginning to get used to it. I have given back a paper (more accurately, a pain in the ass) last week, and I feel very relieved

Quote:
How is your woman?
Everything is fine as well. We went to Constance Lake last week end. Beautiful place
__________________
"I have been reading up on the universe and have come to the conclusion that the universe is a good thing." -- Dissident
"I never had the need to have a boner." -- Dissident
"I have never cut off my penis when I was upset over a girl." -- Dis
Spiffor is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:33   #68
Tingkai
Prince
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 888
Re: We, the sensible people of the United States,...
The article is incredibly naive, contradictory and shallow. The writer hasn't thought about what he/she wrote.



Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE I:
You do not have the right to a new car, big screen TV or any other form of wealth.
Yup, so just because you can afford a gas-guzzling, pollution spewing car doesn't mean you have the right to own one. And just because you want to own a 50-cal machine gun and 200 assault rifles doesn't mean you get to own them. Just because you have money, doesn't mean you get to buy whatever you want, although there will still be lots that you can buy.

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE II:
You do not have the right to never be offended. This country is based on freedom, and that means freedom for everyone -- not just you!
Yup, so just because you don't like people who speak a language other than English doesn't mean you get to deport them. And you don't get to deport them because they eat different food, pray to a different god, celebrate different holidays. You don't get to deport them because they're not "patriotic". You don't get to throw them in jail just because they burn a peice of cloth that they own, that we call the national flag.

Then again, you don't have the right to incite violence against others.

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE III:
You do not have the right to be free from harm.
Nope, this one just doesn't work. We have a right to live in a peaceful society where we are free from harm. People who violate this right (harm someone by murdering them) should pay a penalty.

We most certainly do have the right to be free from harm caused by others.

And yes, people have the right to sue others, even if we think the lawsuit is completely stupid. If the courts side with stupidity, then we have a problem.

Simple, really.

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE IV:
You do not have the right to free food and housing.
Is this what you will tell the starving child who had the misfortune to be born in a poor family?

Economically developed countries have the ability to guarantee that every child has access to shelter, food, healthcare and education. We must ensure all children are free from abuse.

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE V:
You do not have the right to free health care.
Why not? Why should health care be only for those who can afford it. We provide a high-standard of universal healthcare in Canada, as do many other countries. There is no reason not to do it.


Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE VI:
You do not have the right to physically harm other people. ... don't be surprised if the rest of us want to see you fry in the electric chair (yes, capital punishment).
This one is really stupid. It says you do not have the right to kill others, but you do have the right to kill others.

If you do not have the right to kill others than the government cannot allow capital punishment.

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE VII:
You do not have the right to the possessions of others.
Nope, you have the right to possessions of others if they give it to you, such as inheriting property from your parents. A law like this would give the government the power to deny inheritance.

And do we really want to give back the land that was stolen or coerced from the First Nations?

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
You don't have the right to a job.
If that means the government will stop handing out corporate welfare payments, I'm all for it. Let's stop the hand-outs to McDonald's, farming corporations, the rich, and all the other companies that get tax breaks and interest-free loans.

As for an individual's right to a job, I have a right to my current job for the next 18 months. That's the length of my contract.

Also, do you want to be protected from unfair dismissal?

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE IX:
You do not have the right to happiness.
No ****. Next they'll be telling us that we have the right to feel sad.

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
ARTICLE X:
This is an English speaking country. Learn it or go back to the country and the living conditions you were fleeing.
This one is just plain stupid. Either this idiot hasn't heard about freedom of speech, or he doesn't understand it.

We should all have the right to freedom of speech. That means being free to say whatever we want*, in whatever language that you want. If you want to speak Klingon, go for it buddy.

*Within limits. You do not have the right to incite violence. You do not have the right to slander others.
__________________
Golfing since 67
Tingkai is offline  
Old June 12, 2003, 23:44   #69
DinoDoc
Civilization II Democracy GameApolytoners Hall of Fame
Deity
 
DinoDoc's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Underwater no one can hear sharks scream
Posts: 11,096
Quote:
We should all have the right to freedom of speech
Greece and the Netherlands lack freedom of speech? I never knew that.
__________________
Rosbifs are destructive scum- Spiffor
I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
If government is big enough to give you everything you want, it is also big enough to take everything you have. - Gerald Ford
Blackwidow24 and FemmeAdonis fan club
DinoDoc is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 00:10   #70
St Leo
Scenario League / Civ2-CreationApolytoners Hall of Fame
 
St Leo's Avatar
 
Local Time: 23:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: In search of pants
Posts: 5,085
This one is the most funny. Someday, latin descent people will outnumber english-speaking descent people in this country. I guess when they rule and tell you to learn Spanish or get out you will have no right to complain.

Doofus. That will never happen in the US for two reasons:
1) Primary immigrant groups never stay the same.
2) Everyone, especially the second generation everyone, learns English. Well, they do in Canada. Maybe they don't in non-multicultural countries like the US.

I disagree with IV, V, VI, and X. I am not too keen on II, III, VII, and VIII, but I do agree with what is actually written in them if not what is meant.

VIII is interesting because the Right-to-a-Job is something right-wingers are likelier to harp about than left-wingers. After all, they tend to be the ones whose platforms revolve around "more employment opportunities".
__________________
Blog | Civ2 Scenario League | leo.petr at gmail.com
St Leo is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 00:13   #71
The Templar
Prince
 
The Templar's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: People's Republic of the East Village
Posts: 603
Quote:
Originally posted by DinoDoc
Will they at least be more helpful if I make an attempt to speak thier language?
Most people I know with South American ancestry are at least bilingual with Spanish as a first language or were raised bilingual. Yes, I realize many fourth and fifth generation Americans whose distant anscestry spoke only Spanish cannot themselves speak Spanish.

But teaching your kids Spanish and English is no longer frowned upon in imigrant communities. And given that Hispanics are the fastest growing segment of the population, I suggest you guys learn some Spanish.
__________________
- "A picture may be worth a thousand words, but it still ain't a part number." - Ron Reynolds
- I went to Zanarkand, and all I got was this lousy aeon!
- "... over 10 members raised complaints about you... and jerk was one of the nicer things they called you" - Ming
The Templar is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 00:15   #72
Urban Ranger
NationStatesApolyton Storywriters' GuildNever Ending Stories
Deity
 
Urban Ranger's Avatar
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
Quote:
Originally posted by St Leo
VIII is interesting because the Right-to-a-Job is something right-wingers are likelier to harp about than left-wingers. After all, they tend to be the ones whose platforms revolve around "more employment opportunities".
Isn't that why they cut taxes?
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Urban Ranger is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 00:19   #73
Cyclotron
Never Ending StoriesThe Courts of Candle'Bre
King
 
Cyclotron's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cyclo-who?
Posts: 2,995
For the most part, the spanish speakers are at the economic bottom of society. That's why I can live in California and not meet a whole lot, because I just don't know a lot of itinerant farm workers, etcetera.

Economic advancement is impossible without knowing the language, and the language won't change unless people speaking a new language become strong economically. Therefore, English will remain the major language in use.
__________________
Lime roots and treachery!
"Eventually you're left with a bunch of unmemorable posters like Cyclotron, pretending that they actually know anything about who they're debating pointless crap with." - Drake Tungsten
Cyclotron is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 00:28   #74
The Templar
Prince
 
The Templar's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: People's Republic of the East Village
Posts: 603
Quote:
Originally posted by cyclotron7
For the most part, the spanish speakers are at the economic bottom of society. That's why I can live in California and not meet a whole lot, because I just don't know a lot of itinerant farm workers, etcetera.

Economic advancement is impossible without knowing the language, and the language won't change unless people speaking a new language become strong economically. Therefore, English will remain the major language in use.
I live in New York City, where we don't hide from poverty in our suburbs and cars.

I'm saying that the demographic changes in this nation will increase the power of Spanish speaking people. Look, if I were an entrepenuer and saw an underserved market of primarily Spanish-speaking people. I would use Spanish-speaking people to deliver goods and services. My overcoming the language barrier would mean profit for me. Others will follow suit. So the haves in society may legitimate the language of some have not ethnic groups in order to achieve profit.

There you go - a libertarian explanation of why you should learn Spanish.
__________________
- "A picture may be worth a thousand words, but it still ain't a part number." - Ron Reynolds
- I went to Zanarkand, and all I got was this lousy aeon!
- "... over 10 members raised complaints about you... and jerk was one of the nicer things they called you" - Ming
The Templar is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 01:18   #75
Berzerker
Civilization II MultiplayerApolytoners Hall of Fame
Emperor
 
Berzerker's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: topeka, kansas,USA
Posts: 8,164
Tingkai -
Quote:
The article is incredibly naive, contradictory and shallow. The writer hasn't thought about what he/she wrote.
Then you should be able to refute the author's arguments, but you appear to be confused instead.

Quote:
Yup, so just because you can afford a gas-guzzling, pollution spewing car doesn't mean you have the right to own one. And just because you want to own a 50-cal machine gun and 200 assault rifles doesn't mean you get to own them. Just because you have money, doesn't mean you get to buy whatever you want, although there will still be lots that you can buy.
The author says you don't have a right to a new car and you seem to agree after attacking him? Of course, the author is talking about a non-"right" to compel others via government to buy us new cars.

Quote:
Yup, so just because you don't like people who speak a language other than English doesn't mean you get to deport them. And you don't get to deport them because they eat different food, pray to a different god, celebrate different holidays. You don't get to deport them because they're not "patriotic". You don't get to throw them in jail just because they burn a peice of cloth that they own, that we call the national flag.
Where did the author mention deportation for any of these? He asked people refusing to learn English to go home.

Quote:
Nope, this one just doesn't work. We have a right to live in a peaceful society where we are free from harm. People who violate this right (harm someone by murdering them) should pay a penalty. We most certainly do have the right to be free from harm caused by others.
Strawman. The author clearly put that comment into the context of people inline for the Darwin Award and suing the makers of products, nothing about hurting others.

Quote:
And yes, people have the right to sue others, even if we think the lawsuit is completely stupid. If the courts side with stupidity, then we have a problem.
Which was the author's point. So, what do we do to solve this problem? Remove this "right" to sue people for our own stupidity? Hmm...

Quote:
Is this what you will tell the starving child who had the misfortune to be born in a poor family?
Nope, I'd give them food or tell them where to get it.

Quote:
Economically developed countries have the ability to guarantee that every child has access to shelter, food, healthcare and education. We must ensure all children are free from abuse.
Feel free, but my needs don't create a right to steal from you.

Quote:
Why not? Why should health care be only for those who can afford it. We provide a high-standard of universal healthcare in Canada, as do many other countries. There is no reason not to do it.
That all depends on how we define the word "right". If I have a "right" to force you to pay for my health care, and since "rights" are supposed to be equal, then why can't a rich person exercise the right to force poor people to pay for their health care? And what you have in Canada or anywhere else is irrelevant, the author has provided a satirical addendum to the US Bill of Rights.

Quote:
This one is really stupid. It says you do not have the right to kill others, but you do have the right to kill others. If you do not have the right to kill others than the government cannot allow capital punishment.
Please tell us you understand the distinction between a murderer and their victim... I don't have a right to put you in a cage, but if you run around punching people, that's what'll happen here and in Canada.

Quote:
Nope, you have the right to possessions of others if they give it to you, such as inheriting property from your parents. A law like this would give the government the power to deny inheritance.
If you had a right to your parents property, their will would be irrelevant. Now you're confusing rights with privileges...

Quote:
If that means the government will stop handing out corporate welfare payments, I'm all for it. Let's stop the hand-outs to McDonald's, farming corporations, the rich, and all the other companies that get tax breaks and interest-free loans.
Sounds good to me, but you lack consistency here, not the author. I don't see where he said corporations have this right to government subsidies.

Quote:
As for an individual's right to a job, I have a right to my current job for the next 18 months. That's the length of my contract.
Did you have a right to that job before the contract?

Quote:
Also, do you want to be protected from unfair dismissal?
Did the author say we have no rights under contractual obligations?

Quote:
No ****. Next they'll be telling us that we have the right to feel sad.
The author was merely pointing out the difference between the right to pursue happiness and the non-right to be happy at the expense of others.

Quote:
This one is just plain stupid. Either this idiot hasn't heard about freedom of speech, or he doesn't understand it.

We should all have the right to freedom of speech. That means being free to say whatever we want*, in whatever language that you want. If you want to speak Klingon, go for it buddy.
Did the author demand that government deport people for not speaking English? Nope... That was quite a hatchet job...
Berzerker is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 01:22   #76
ajbera
Prince
 
ajbera's Avatar
 
Local Time: 03:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: of the Cookieville Minimum Security Orphanarium
Posts: 428
As a capitalist/entrepeneur, it would behoove me to learn the language of any people in whom I saw a viable market. It doesn't matter if they were immigrants in my country or the natives of a faraway land. But it's beside the point.

People, native residents, immigrants, everyone, should continue to learn and improve themselves, including learning additional languages. It's always positive to expand abilities and horizons.

However, there needs to be a default, standard language by which the peoples of a particular place are able to communicate without hindrance. One language that everyone is taught so they can fully communicate their thoughts, wants, and needs without the need for interpretation, translation, and risk of miscommunication. The dominant and most common language in the United States for the longest period of time is English; hence it's what the default language should be.

Furthermore, even with English as the primary language, there's plenty of miscommunication, frequently through sloppy usage and plain ignorance. Allowing a second (or more) language into the mix could bring about greater miscommunication.
ajbera is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 01:59   #77
Mr. President
MacSpanish CiversNationStatesNever Ending StoriesCivilization II Democracy Game: ExodusApolyton Storywriters' GuildACDG Planet University of Technology
Emperor
 
Mr. President's Avatar
 
Local Time: 13:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: You can be me when I'm gone
Posts: 3,640
What was the point of this thread? Trying to start a Leftist Dance of Death?
__________________
Everything changes, but nothing is truly lost.
Mr. President is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 02:02   #78
MichaeltheGreat
Apolytoners Hall of Fame
Apolyton Grand Executioner
 
MichaeltheGreat's Avatar
 
Local Time: 19:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Fenway Pahk
Posts: 1,755
Quote:
Originally posted by Kidicious


I don't want to be obligated to work. That means I'm not going to do it.
Hey, that's ok, if you're a hot looking young stud, you can find a sugar momma, or if you swing that way, you can be a rent boy.

Other than that, you can enjoy all the results and fruits of not working all you want.
__________________
Bush-Cheney 2008. What's another amendment between friends?
*******
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all.
MichaeltheGreat is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 02:04   #79
MichaeltheGreat
Apolytoners Hall of Fame
Apolyton Grand Executioner
 
MichaeltheGreat's Avatar
 
Local Time: 19:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Fenway Pahk
Posts: 1,755
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr. President
What was the point of this thread? Trying to start a Leftist Dance of Death?
It's just a whiny Rush Limbaugh crowd troll that's been going around email for months. Instead of sharing the "wisdom" by email, it got shared by thread.
__________________
Bush-Cheney 2008. What's another amendment between friends?
*******
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all.
MichaeltheGreat is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 05:33   #80
Urban Ranger
NationStatesApolyton Storywriters' GuildNever Ending Stories
Deity
 
Urban Ranger's Avatar
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
Wow, it's from Rush Limbaugh? I don't know, it's hard to imagine Slowwhand stooping that low. Sad.
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Urban Ranger is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 05:42   #81
Berzerker
Civilization II MultiplayerApolytoners Hall of Fame
Emperor
 
Berzerker's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: topeka, kansas,USA
Posts: 8,164
Nah, someone else wrote it, Limbaugh just read it on the air.
Berzerker is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 11:32   #82
mrmitchell
Civilization III Democracy GamePtWDG RoleplayCall to Power Democracy GameInterSite Democracy Game: Apolyton TeamNationStatesPtWDG2 Tabemono
King
 
mrmitchell's Avatar
 
Local Time: 21:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,394
It's too late. It's been tainted.

Ming, please close this thread immediately before it's too late.
__________________
meet the new boss, same as the old boss
mrmitchell is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 12:10   #83
Lefty Scaevola
lifer
Emperor
 
Lefty Scaevola's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: San Antonio TX USA
Posts: 3,815
Quote:
Originally posted by Oerdin
You find the idea of a national language to be disturbing? So 90% of the world disturbs you?
The learn it or leave distrubs me.
__________________
Gaius Mucius Scaevola Sinistra
Japher: "crap, did I just post in this thread?"
"Bloody hell, Lefty.....number one in my list of persons I have no intention of annoying, ever." Bugs ****ing Bunny
From a 6th grader who readily adpated to internet culture: "Pay attention now, because your opinions suck"
Lefty Scaevola is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 12:12   #84
SlowwHand
inmate
Civilization II MultiplayerApolytoners Hall of FameGameLeague
Deity
 
SlowwHand's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 27,637
Tingkai, you're the biggest dreamer I've ever seen.
Completely oblivious to life in the real-world.

Good luck, buddy.
God knows you'll need it.
__________________
Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
SlowwHand is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 12:47   #85
MrFun
Emperor
 
MrFun's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Illinois
Posts: 8,595
Quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
Tingkai, you're the biggest dreamer I've ever seen.
Completely oblivious to life in the real-world.

Good luck, buddy.
God knows you'll need it.
Isn't it politically incorrect to assume that he believes in God?
__________________
STFU and then GTFO!
MrFun is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 13:07   #86
Oerdin
Deity
 
Oerdin's Avatar
 
Local Time: 20:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: In a bamboo forest hiding from Dale.
Posts: 17,436
Re: Re: We, the sensible people of the United States,...
Quote:
Originally posted by Tingkai
Yup, so just because you can afford a gas-guzzling, pollution spewing car doesn't mean you have the right to own one.
Want to bet?

Quote:
And just because you want to own a 50-cal machine gun and 200 assault rifles doesn't mean you get to own them.
Please note that is a very clear cut case of public safety over riding individual rights. You might not like SUVs but they just aren't a public safety issue no matter how much you wish they were.

Quote:
Yup, so just because you don't like people who speak a language other than English doesn't mean you get to deport them.
Nice red herring. We are talking about which sort of standards and requirements we, as a nation or group of nations, should place up peaople who wish to immigrate. Should they know about the history and culture of the nation they wish to live in? Should they be able to function and be employable (I.E. speak the national language)? Should they be free of communicable diseases? All of these are valid points which are legitament things immigration and naturalization can look at in order to determine an individual's suitability for naturalization.
Quote:
And yes, people have the right to sue others, even if we think the lawsuit is completely stupid. If the courts side with stupidity, then we have a problem.
I agree but we should have a loser pays system like the British have so people who file groundless law suites can be punished instead of the victim of groundless law suites.
Quote:
Why not? Why should health care be only for those who can afford it. We provide a high-standard of universal healthcare in Canada, as do many other countries. There is no reason not to do it.
How about the reason that it costs to much and I don't want to pay for you? You are making a value judgement based upon desires and not natural or legal rights. You may think something is a good idea but that doesn't mean you have a right to it.

Quote:
If you do not have the right to kill others than the government cannot allow capital punishment.
Want to bet? Ever heard of war? Most research has concluded that capital punishmentis an effective deternent to violent crime so in order to save innocent lives you use the most effective deterent to puinish the criminals. The punishment fits the crime and is just.
Quote:
And do we really want to give back the land that was stolen or coerced from the First Nations?
Who themselves stole it from other native groups, who stole it from other native groups, who...
__________________
Christianity is the belief in a cosmic Jewish zombie who can give us eternal life if we symbolically eat his flesh and blood and telepathically tell him that we accept him as our lord and master so he can remove an evil force present in all humanity because a woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from an apple tree.

Last edited by Oerdin; June 13, 2003 at 13:12.
Oerdin is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 13:10   #87
MrFun
Emperor
 
MrFun's Avatar
 
Local Time: 22:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Illinois
Posts: 8,595
So if you do not have the right to happiness, why does the government still carry out corporate welfare for the wealthy?
__________________
STFU and then GTFO!
MrFun is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 13:18   #88
mindseye
King
 
mindseye's Avatar
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: A Yankee living in Shanghai
Posts: 1,149
Quote:
This is an English speaking country. We don't care where you are
from. We welcome you here. English is our language and like the one
you left behind, we also have a culture. Learn it or go back to the
country and the living conditions you were fleeing."
Could we apply this domestically?

Hey, you folks with the Big Hair, the ten-gallon hats, talking like you got marbles in your mouth ... either get with it, or get back to Texas where you fled from.
mindseye is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 13:19   #89
mindseye
King
 
mindseye's Avatar
 
Local Time: 11:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: A Yankee living in Shanghai
Posts: 1,149
Afterthought ...

Quote:
English is our language and like the one you left behind, we also have a culture.
Whoever wrote this doesn't speak English very well ...
mindseye is offline  
Old June 13, 2003, 13:20   #90
Oerdin
Deity
 
Oerdin's Avatar
 
Local Time: 20:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: In a bamboo forest hiding from Dale.
Posts: 17,436
Quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
So if you do not have the right to happiness, why does the government still carry out corporate welfare for the wealthy?
It's a form of protectionism which governments use as a way to boost employment and support local industries. In the long run it harms the competetiveness of the very industries they're trying to support.
__________________
Christianity is the belief in a cosmic Jewish zombie who can give us eternal life if we symbolically eat his flesh and blood and telepathically tell him that we accept him as our lord and master so he can remove an evil force present in all humanity because a woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from an apple tree.
Oerdin is offline  
 

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 23:33.


Design by Vjacheslav Trushkin, color scheme by ColorizeIt!.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Apolyton Civilization Site | Copyright © The Apolyton Team