DESIGN: CTP2 Bugs and alterations [fix list] - Page 2

Martin Gühmann · July 30, 2003, 13:16

Quote:

Originally posted by hexagonian
There was a food hunger flag in Units.txt that I'd really like to see activated - as well as a possible ongoing gold maintenance cost for units. This would make resource management more critical for having large armies.

Did you try this flag Dave? I never tried it to see its effect so far I don't know if it works.

-Martin

MrBaggins · July 30, 2003, 13:17

I tried it, and it doesn't work.

tlatoani · July 30, 2003, 13:51

Could it be possible to have units in enemy territory begging to have their health reduced unless they plunder farms or trade posts?

Pedrunn · July 30, 2003, 14:04

Create a type of "/reloadslic" with the same characteristics but that preserve the values of the variables!

MrBaggins · July 30, 2003, 14:10

Quote:

Originally posted by tlatoani
Could it be possible to have units in enemy territory begging to have their health reduced unless they plunder farms or trade posts?

can be done already with slic, I believe

tlatoani · July 30, 2003, 14:22

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBaggins

can be done already with slic, I believe

I think this is a good idea because it would force the AI, and the human, to either attack more speedily or get out of the enemies borders and not hang around loitering. It would also create a need for plundering, not just being nasty to the enemy’s population by taking their food. Although that could always be a reason

Ekmek · July 30, 2003, 16:18

Andthe attrition concept is like Rise of Nations, maybe a supply unit could be made that would prevent this attrition in borders and kiling this unit would grant pw or gold.

Solver · July 30, 2003, 16:30

That attrition like stuff is already something that can be implemented via SLIC without any source modification. Besides, I view it as a highly arguable thing.

tlatoani · July 31, 2003, 12:44

Quote:

Originally posted by Solver
That attrition like stuff is already something that can be implemented via SLIC without any source modification. Besides, I view it as a highly arguable thing.

Attrition is a good thing. What killed off Napoleon's army but the Russian winter and the lack of supplies. When he found Moscow deserted he had to go back. Even now, the US was worried that by advancing too fast their supply lines could get stretched too thin and get cut off. Armies march on their stomachs.

Even if it can be implemented only via slic, it doesn't mean it should be something to forget about. It can add another dimension to the game if you had to worry about feeding your troops via a supply unit or plundering.

Solver · July 31, 2003, 12:52

Yeah, but I don't somehow feel like it

.

Maquiladora · July 31, 2003, 13:06

I think it should be a mod if anything. When all these new ideas start coming out its always a good idea to look back at civ2, simple gameplay and yet deep strategy = fun.

ískallin · July 31, 2003, 13:11

I like this idea and i would like to see it brought further,
In say the modern age you have a tank unit that's out of gas(the fuel thing on tanks is easy) then you bring a supply unit that you put on the same square as the tank a push a button named "resupply" or something and then the supply unit is deleted and the tank refuled.

tlatoani · July 31, 2003, 13:18

Another area that could be incorporated into the base line version of the new CTP2, even though it can be added via SLIC, is the religion aspect of the game. Religion can be a source for alliances or wars, and conversion to your religion is a good thing, even if you’re not a fundamentalist state.

tlatoani · July 31, 2003, 13:19

Just to clarify that I think these ideas should be done after the main bugs have been ironed out.

Solver · July 31, 2003, 13:23

Religion I guess can be on the list... many Civ 3 people want it too

.

Martin Gühmann · July 31, 2003, 13:28

Quote:

Originally posted by tlatoani
Another area that could be incorporated into the base line version of the new CTP2, even though it can be added via SLIC, is the religion aspect of the game.

Yeah, but if you /reloadslic in the current religion mod all the religion is gone or set back. So the source code implementation is the better way to have it. So a Const.txt entry for religion and you can decide if it is in the game or not or put it into the userprofile.txt.

-Martin

Solver · July 31, 2003, 13:35

Why, it's not too hard to add another equivalent of reloadslic that would preserve variable value.

st_swithin · July 31, 2003, 13:38

FIX A*!!!!

"WORST PATHING ALGORITHM EVER!!!" -entire CTP1 and CTP2 production team

Solver · July 31, 2003, 13:40

Swithin, any specific advice on which algorithm to use?

Besides, CtP2 pathfinding, well, works. I don't see units getting stuck or ships unable to get around islands.

st_swithin · July 31, 2003, 13:43

yeah, anything BUT a*. Maybe call some people at JPL or NASA - they were using a really good pathfinder for the MARS exploration. But for the little discrepancy of royal vs. metric, it would've worked.

I bet they'd license it for almost nothing, because they probably didn't know that they had a really good pathing system.

Martin Gühmann · July 31, 2003, 13:52

Quote:

Originally posted by Solver
Why, it's not too hard to add another equivalent of reloadslic that would preserve variable value.

Of course this could be implemented but sometimes at least in the current version of CTP2 it is needed to get rid of the values of some variables. For instance we have the situation that the game crashs. But if you /reloadslic before the game does not crash and continues. Well and compiled code is still faster then interpreted code, even if it is something like Java with an interpreted bytecode. I guess slic is something like this otherwise there wouldn't be the need for reloading slic, when you change a piece of your code.

Quote:

Originally posted by Solver
Besides, CtP2 pathfinding, well, works. I don't see units getting stuck or ships unable to get around islands.

Yeah for the humans, but for AIs we saw a lot of stacks just sitting on a road and blocking, Harlan had problems with in his Alexander scenario. So there is a difference between algorithms that are good enough for humans and good enough for AIs. And normally the pathfinding algorithm moves my units around islands, even if the territory is clamed by someone else and I have a non trespassing treaty with them.

-Martin

tlatoani · July 31, 2003, 13:57

Double post. Don't know what happened.

Solver · July 31, 2003, 14:34

As for reloadslic, we can implement yet another command /clearvar to nullify one variable, if need be.

Tamerlin · July 31, 2003, 18:12

Quote:

Originally posted by tlatoani
Attrition is a good thing. What killed off Napoleon's army but the Russian winter and the lack of supplies. When he found Moscow deserted he had to go back. Even now, the US was worried that by advancing too fast their supply lines could get stretched too thin and get cut off. Armies march on their stomachs.

Don't forget CtP2 is a very large scale strategy game about civilization building, a turn lasts from 20 years to 1 year.

I am playing tabletop wargames and nothing is more painful in the grand strategy games than managing things that should only be considered in tactical or operational level simulations. Pillage is thus enough IMHO.

Solver · July 31, 2003, 18:23

Yup... attrition would destroy much of the fun in some campaigns... guess that's why noone's done it yet.

hexagonian · July 31, 2003, 21:36

A small one...

When loading a saved gamefile, you usually can make peace with everyone that you were at war with - I don't know if this is a SLIC related thing.

st_swithin · July 31, 2003, 23:37

nope, it's a coded bug.

Pedrunn · August 1, 2003, 00:14

Quote:

Originally posted by hexagonian
A small one...

When loading a saved gamefile, you usually can make peace with everyone that you were at war with - I don't know if this is a SLIC related thing.

Never noticed that

Pedrunn · August 1, 2003, 00:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Solver
Religion I guess can be on the list... many Civ 3 people want it too

.

Have you seen the religion mod?

Solver · August 1, 2003, 03:53

Yup, I have... enhancements always possible, though, are they not

?