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Old October 22, 2003, 21:37   #121
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Pekka, It is a MS (Master of Science) or MA (Master of Arts), not MD, that is for medical school students.

I am planning to major in Evolutionary Biology at a very good, but small, college in northern Wisconsin that focuses on science and the humanities.

The main reason I think required courses are needed is to stop ignorance, which fuels such things as creationism, political apathy, racism, religious fundimentalism, etc.

I just wish college was payed for by taxes, high school education has become a fiscal black hole from the dumbing down of the curiculum, so now it like paying for some real education people should of gotten in high school.
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Old October 22, 2003, 22:33   #122
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USNA teaches the way people did 100 years ago. We still have recitation and no TAs and required attendance and graded homework and the like. It's just like high school, but at higher courses. I think that is a lot better than what I see in univesities where you have lecture halls full of people. Why should the methodology change because of the material changing. I learn calculus and chemistry, the same way I learn wrestling and gymnastics. With practice.
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Old October 22, 2003, 23:39   #123
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I think some people forget that college is for specialized education. SO that you can get more training and knowledge for the field of work you want to go into. Most of this other stuff just comes from living life, from your parents, and other people who have been around longer then you and have lots of wisdom. Looking to a university I think is a big misstake.

I am going to school so that I can go into computer programming, not so that I can learn morals or other things. I look towards my parents and religion for that.
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Old October 22, 2003, 23:42   #124
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Quote:
Originally posted by Odin
Pekka, It is a MS (Master of Science) or MA (Master of Arts), not MD, that is for medical school students.

I am planning to major in Evolutionary Biology at a very good, but small, college in northern Wisconsin that focuses on science and the humanities.

The main reason I think required courses are needed is to stop ignorance, which fuels such things as creationism, political apathy, racism, religious fundimentalism, etc.

I just wish college was payed for by taxes, high school education has become a fiscal black hole from the dumbing down of the curiculum, so now it like paying for some real education people should of gotten in high school.
Well here in my state of California, California residents only have to pay a flat fee of about $1200 dollars a semister. THat is for a full time student in the CSU system. Lots of tax money goes into the Public universities and community college system here, but fees have been going up because of the buget problems in here in California.
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Old October 23, 2003, 00:48   #125
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I'm for the core classes. I took science as a joke, but now I wish I didn't so much. I'd like to know more about physics (at least). Though I did learn some about Astronomy and the Greenhouse Effect .

It probably was better for me than another Political Science, History, or Economics course (of which I had plenty).

Though I'm happy I didn't have to take more math than I did .
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Old October 23, 2003, 02:04   #126
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Originally posted by Azazel

I guess I really like our system, then.

Of course, students have to organize themselves, but I don't know how it is in Europe, but in Israel, you cannot enroll, if you won't be able to study properly ( class rooms, etc.)
I don't know why, but it seems that your systems drag you on through university for eternity.
Well university access varies widely across Europe. The Austrian system of open access is a bit out of line. The politicians established it, but never put up the money to pay for it. We have about 2500 profs for 200-250000 students. Add to that about 8000 "Assistents" which includes everything from associate profs to lab rats, but it still means many institutes are seriously understaffed.
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Old October 23, 2003, 03:01   #127
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Quote:
Originally posted by Odin
Pekka, It is a MS (Master of Science) or MA (Master of Arts), not MD, that is for medical school students.

I am planning to major in Evolutionary Biology at a very good, but small, college in northern Wisconsin that focuses on science and the humanities.

The main reason I think required courses are needed is to stop ignorance, which fuels such things as creationism, political apathy, racism, religious fundimentalism, etc.
You forgot Communism.
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Old October 23, 2003, 03:43   #128
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No to required courses. I know some friends that werent motivated in required courses and scored lower GPS than their core classes. Its a little bit unfair to have your GPA lowered just because you ****ed around in some class you didnt want to be in in the first place. Sure the person deserve the low grade that they earned ultimately, but what was the reason that I registered this calss in the first place? given choice that person probably wpuldnt have been in that class to avoid such grade.

Plus What Jack said. If you are interested in learning broad, you should have access to, but if not you shouldnt be forced.
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Old October 23, 2003, 04:53   #129
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Add to all of this is the fact that a much higher percentage of Americans go to college/university than in most other countries.
Yeah well, half of the colleges are crappy.
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Old October 23, 2003, 04:59   #130
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odin, OOOOOOOOPS you're absolutely correct.
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Old October 23, 2003, 05:34   #131
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That's why I got thousands of books everywhere, from the sciences to engineering to philosophy to how to write scripts.

I will soon sleep on books
You too, huh?

I can't stand to see a good book tossed. Probably half of my collection are textbooks and novels someone left out for trash.
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Old October 23, 2003, 05:48   #132
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I sold some of my textbooks when I was a poor student. I wish I hadn't.
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Old October 23, 2003, 07:54   #133
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I believe Oxford/Cambridge gives its graduates a masters degree rather than a bachelors.
Not as such. Everyone who graduates at Oxbridge is a BA or BSc, but they have the option of paying for a master's degree too. This basically means that masters' from Oxbridge are worthless, but that doesn't seem to deter employers. There is no extra study involved for a master's, but you can greatly improve your CV if you ahve the right kind of money.
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Old October 23, 2003, 09:40   #134
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Yeah well, half of the colleges are crappy.
Even with half of the attendees, the US would have a much higher percentage attending than most countries.
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Old October 23, 2003, 09:54   #135
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In many countries, perhaps even most countries, a college degree is not required prior to entering medical school. Students can matriculate right out of high school.
Like here. You enter for 7 years, and end up being an MD, witha M.Sc, or a B.A in life sciences, as well.

Quote:

Well university access varies widely across Europe. The Austrian system of open access is a bit out of line. The politicians established it, but never put up the money to pay for it. We have about 2500 profs for 200-250000 students. Add to that about 8000 "Assistents" which includes everything from associate profs to lab rats, but it still means many institutes are seriously understaffed.
This doesn't sound right. They tried to do the same thing here, to let more people enroll, but the academia strongly protested, saying that it will lower the level of education, since no additional money was spent on hiring those lecturers needed, which creates the weird situations in which universities hold relatively low amounts of students, while doing lots of research.

here's a link I found about research rankings of economics departments in Europe. You can see that Israel has got two Unis in the top 10 ( my university is 28th ). In other research, Israel still ranks highly. AND STILL, those two big universities ( HebrewU and TAU ) hold only 22k and 27k students, respectively, while big universities around the world hold 40k or more.
Our institute has only some 12k students...
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Old October 23, 2003, 11:11   #136
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and where's the link?
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Old October 23, 2003, 11:37   #137
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This doesn't sound right.
You mean the information is not correct? Or if you mean that's a totally stupid idea, then absolutely yes. But hardly surprising, as it came from politicians.
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Old October 23, 2003, 12:08   #138
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Even with half of the attendees, the US would have a much higher percentage attending than most countries.
That just barely counters the high percentage of illiteracy there.
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Old October 23, 2003, 12:22   #139
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HHa! 100% here! Beat that! IN your faces! We RRrock!

edit: that would be ability to read and write, not illiteracy
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Old October 23, 2003, 12:56   #140
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So Pekka, what is the rate of functional illiteracy in Finland?
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Old October 23, 2003, 12:58   #141
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HershOstropoler, I CRUSH!
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Old October 23, 2003, 13:20   #142
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That could hurt.
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Old October 23, 2003, 13:22   #143
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ah, the link:
http://www.univie.ac.at/Wirtschaftsw...anking2001.htm
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Old October 23, 2003, 13:27   #144
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Ahh but those were only economic rankings.. that's for sissies! Azazel, we need to get you back on the track, so change your studies to software engineering FAST.
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Old October 23, 2003, 13:35   #145
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HELL NO! I AM NOT STUDYING ECONOMICS!
Though sometimes, I wish I was... they have so much less classes, for some reason..

I am studying Chemistry. WTF is Software engineering? I only know Comp. Sci. and it sucks.
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Old October 23, 2003, 15:19   #146
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That just barely counters the high percentage of illiteracy there.
Shoot. We're light years ahead of Hong Kong.

We're middle of the pack on functional literacy--we're brought down somewhat by the high number of immigrants.
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Old October 23, 2003, 17:35   #147
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Originally posted by Azazel
ah, the link:
http://www.univie.ac.at/Wirtschaftsw...anking2001.htm
Ah, university of Vienna... they love doing all kinds of rankings, usually of limited quality, even for rankings...

But I have little doubt that Israel is doing quite well in science...
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Old October 23, 2003, 17:37   #148
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Since when is economics considered "science"? ... puh-lease.
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Old October 23, 2003, 17:37   #149
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Azazel, it's something fun you can do when you're at comp.sci.. . It's basically programming.
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Old October 23, 2003, 17:47   #150
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Since when is economics considered "science"? ... puh-lease.
What gives you the strange idea i was talking about economics when I said "science"?
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