Where has all the "real evil" gone in our games, written works, t.v. and movies?

Vesayen · October 22, 2003, 21:22

In fictional works, games, movies etc.... where has all the "real evil" gone?

I mean hardcore raping children while their mothers watch and vice versa evil.

I'm sick of "evil light" in my fiction.....

Here is the difference between evil and evil light in games/fiction.

The evil light evil emperor, god, person etc kills lots of innocent people and takes over the kingdom, oh no!

Those people are NEVER shown, and barley described...... oh-this person is tremendousley evil even though we dont show him as such.....

Real evil shows that, it EXPLAINS why it is evil, saying "oh he conquered the whole country!" dosent cut it anymore.......

I hoped I described this well, I doubt I did though.

I'm just sick of "vanilla" evil-I've built up a tollerance.

Tuberski · October 22, 2003, 21:32

Read "The Seer King", "The Demon King" and "THe Warrior King" by Chris Bunch.

Laish Tenedos is about as evil as they come.

ACK!

monkspider · October 22, 2003, 21:35

This is a very pertinent post.

St Leo · October 22, 2003, 21:40

Try Perdido Street Station, The Scar, and King Rat by China Mieville.

Spiffor · October 22, 2003, 21:42

Real Evil is gone to the White House

NeOmega · October 22, 2003, 21:51

I don't like real evil in my fiction. I like compexity. I like confusion, it helps the suspense. ie FF VII was great, you satrted working for Shin-Ra.

Ming · October 22, 2003, 21:53

You just need to select fictional works better... there is more than enough REAL EVIL out there. Maybe you shouldn't be picking stuff that has PG 13 ratings

NeOmega · October 22, 2003, 22:12

To me, the only difference between good and evil in fiction, is who wins in the end. That's why I don't like to know who the good guy is.

BTW, I don't read fiction books. And of course, I hate most movies, because it is too obvious too early who the bad guy is.

Nubclear · October 22, 2003, 22:17

Quote:

Originally posted by Vesayen
where has all the "real evil" gone?

In fiction, there is no "real" evil

However......

http://www.whitehouse.gov

http://www.pmo.gov.il/english/

http://www.nad-plo.org/

Q Classic · October 22, 2003, 22:21

real evil?

read anything by anne rice.

no, the stuff she writes about isn't the evil part.

it's the actual fact of reading her that's the real evil. it'll make you want to crush your own skull while you watch.

especially if you read something like "beauty".

Tuberski · October 22, 2003, 22:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar

In fiction, there is no "real" evil

However......

http://www.whitehouse.gov

http://www.pmo.gov.il/english/

http://www.nad-plo.org/

You forgot 1:

www.pure_evil.com

ACK!

St Leo · October 22, 2003, 22:24

Cthulhu in 2004. Why vote for a lesser evil?

Dr Strangelove · October 22, 2003, 23:46

Since when was child molestation ever a major part of literature? Has someone done gone and changed us over to the NAMBLA channel?

JohnT · October 23, 2003, 02:06

Lolita, anyone?

Dis · October 23, 2003, 02:55

Watch Kill Bill

nothing like having a coma patient repeatedly raped in the hospital.

If that's not evil then what is?

And then you have the paedophilia guy who was killed by the young Japanese girl.

Chemical Ollie · October 23, 2003, 03:57

Romeo's Juliet was 11 years old

Zero · October 23, 2003, 04:03

real evil? If thats the way you see fiction I guess I see why you're pissed.

But Im annoyed by these so called "real evil". Often they have no real motives or reason to be evil. And evn more often the motives are so lame and ciched.

I like fiction where protagonists and antagonists are like real life people and dont hold black and white flag to represent who they are,

Urban Ranger · October 23, 2003, 04:03

Boys Don't Cry is nasty.

Urban Ranger · October 23, 2003, 04:06

Quote:

Originally posted by Zero
But Im annoyed by these so called "real evil". Often they have no real motives or reason to be evil. And evn more often the motives are so lame and ciched.

"Real evil" is stupid. Anybody can put in a thing that kils and rapes at random. That's why Scream is stupid.

Rufus T. Firefly · October 23, 2003, 04:20

If you want real evil in your reading, try the "Burke" detective novels of Andrew Vachss; they tend to focus on cases involving abused children, and to so in moral terms which treats such abuse as an absolute Evil, rather than an exploitative plot device. And he's a good writer to boot.

Now, if you want to read an interesting meditation on the nature of evil, told in fantasy form, I highly recommend Gregory Maguire's Wicked. It's generally reviewed as "The Wizard of Oz told from teh Wicked Witch's point of view," but that barely scratches the surface of such an intelligent, provocative, and truly beautiful novel. His other stuff isn't nearly so good, but this is a masterpiece

Spiffor · October 23, 2003, 08:07

There are some good Real Evils in John Woo's movies. In The Killer, gotta love how easy for the villain it is to kill children

(btw, the villain of Face/Off kills the kid of the nice guy at the beginning, and ends up killing his own friends

)

Vesayen · October 23, 2003, 12:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Dissident
Watch Kill Bill

nothing like having a coma patient repeatedly raped in the hospital.

If that's not evil then what is?

And then you have the paedophilia guy who was killed by the young Japanese girl.

Yah, seeing that movie made me realize 'real evil' isnt in MOST fiction, film etc-that movie had some really evil parts.

Also, when I said "real evil" I dont mean cthullu, I mean REAL evil with real motivations-realistic. I'm sick of these uber evil people with craptastic motivations.

Solver · October 23, 2003, 12:41

Stephen King's books contain some real evil stuff... they describe the evil so well...

General Ludd · October 23, 2003, 13:52

If you like forgotten realms books (which you probably don't) try reading Twightlight Falling. Lots of 'real evil' in there, even if you do have to put up with a cliche of a halfling (but he get's what's comin' to 'im). Lots of torture, people being flayed alive, ect..

EDIT: And even the 'good guys' are cut-throats and assassins.

Ben Kenobi · October 23, 2003, 14:08

Quote:

it's the actual fact of reading her that's the real evil. it'll make you want to crush your own skull while you watch.

Read Conrad's Heart of Darkness

Lord of the Flies fits your bill.

The Andy-Man · October 23, 2003, 15:13

I don't want to real 'evil' seplt out to me, i want to have to see that even the bad guys are good and the good guys are bad. I want to see that line crossed were to 'good guy' can be just as sick as the 'bad guy' cos, once that line is crossed, it all merges into one

Immortal Wombat · October 23, 2003, 17:18

Juliet was 14

Best example I've read recently is in Terry Goodkind's Sword of Truth series, but apart from the evil scenes which he is woryingly good at, the rest of the writing is a bit poor, so I wouldn't recommend them.

Dr Strangelove · October 23, 2003, 18:39

Quote:

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi

Read Conrad's Heart of Darkness

Lord of the Flies fits your bill.

....errrrr, I don't remember the child rape part inLord of the Flies , though there definitely was some child murder. Then again, beingBritish schoolboys there probably was a little buggery going on.

In modern TV, films and even most literature villains tend to rather one dimensional. Since mass media is now all about selling authors tend to go for shock value instead of substance.

Q Classic · October 23, 2003, 20:07

oh, what about evil dead, with that tree rape scene?

st_swithin · October 23, 2003, 20:35

Catholic priests, Roman Polanski, Alfred Hitchcock, really old Clive Barker books (i.e. Books of Blood), doors that have handles/knobs that don't make clear whether to push or pull, mall architects, Hollywood Nazis, Microsoft security, the IRS, city planners, yearbook editors, friends with too many drugs, friends without any drugs, the WonderBra (wonder what I'm gonna put in it), 'organic' foods, inorganic foods, red dye #4, and nosy neighbors.